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Posted By: PerfectSpiral Israel at war again. - 01/03/24 06:21 PM
Quote
As an observer of the Middle East and in depth study of how religion escalates tensions between countries causing their wars, it’s no surprise it continues and I’m basically numb to their insanity as they all continue to wage war. The USA involvement is also insane. It’s basically the reason the Arab world hates US. Killing… in the name of god.

I'm not the one who said I've grown numb to it. You did.

Actually I didn’t say that. But please continue to lash out. I’m all ears.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/03/24 06:27 PM
US given no heads up about Israeli air strike on Sr Hamas leader in Beirut
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/03/24 06:28 PM
I quoted you verbatim. Denial is probably your best bet at this juncture. The entire discussion was concerning innocent civilians and this was your response to that.... "I’m basically numb to their insanity as they all continue to wage war." That is the epitome of saying you simply no longer care about it either way.
Posted By: dawglover05 Re: Israel at war again. - 01/03/24 06:29 PM
I'll be curious now if Hezbollah ramps up given the incursion into Lebanon.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/03/24 06:35 PM
I'm curious as well. Then there's the Yemen's Houthi movement attacking ships in The Red Sea. Some people are curious how this will all unfold and the consequences of it all while some have grown numb to it.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/03/24 06:36 PM
To be truthful it’s my way of dealing with things I can’t control.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/03/24 06:39 PM
Originally Posted by dawglover05
I'll be curious now if Hezbollah ramps up given the incursion into Lebanon.


Yep with this and the Iran bombings, escalation is imminent.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/03/24 06:42 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
while some have grown numb to it.

GMAFB Low blow.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/03/24 06:46 PM
You yourself said you had grown numb to it. Then you further backed that up by explaining why you feel that way....

Quote
To be truthful it’s my way of dealing with things I can’t control.

Now you sound outraged by me pointing out exactly what you have been saying all along. That's more than slightly confusing to say the least.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/03/24 09:19 PM
Not really, but I find it amusing you think you know everything,. Then when somebody points out you don’t you lash out at them.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/04/24 04:16 PM
Quoting your own words is not lashing out at you no matter hows you try to spin that. Blaming me for your words doesn't actually work. And I don't think "I know everything". But I do know enough to understand that using 2000 lb. bombs are meant to destroy large swaths of area and not a specific target. I know that anyone using them understands that even when they lie to the contrary. I know that purposefully kills large numbers of innocent civilians. I know you said you were numb to it and explained why. That's a very basic understanding of a few pertinent facts.

And the odd thing about that is I get it. I understand why some people would be numb to it. I remember as far back as the war over there in 1973 when Syria and Egypt were involved. It's been going on for what seems like forever in that region. Which would cause many to simply throw their hands up and feel like it's not worth them worrying about or being concerned about it because they can't do anything about it. So I do get it.

I watched America and much of the world become outraged over what Hamas did to innocent Israeli citizens as they should have. I did as well. There was no excuse for such horrendous actions. But at the same time it doesn't excuse Israel from exacting revenge by using weapons which accomplish that exact same thing. Having no excuse to do such things is a two way street.

As we saw with the targeted strike in Lebanon to kill that Hamas leader, Israel knows exactly how to execute a targeted strike if they so choose. They know how to accomplish that without inflicting mass civilian casualties. They know the type of weapons to use to avoid such casualties. They have chosen not to in Gaza. I for one won't sit around and make excuses for it and I will call it for what it is. If you choose a different path so be it.

I've sat here over the past nine years now watching a venomous individual say and do horrible things while running our nation. I've seen him say out loud that if he wins it's fair and if he loses it's not every time he has ran for office. I've watched this play out on full display. At first everyone was shocked and surprised by the things he said. They were appalled by his nastiness and understood he wasn't fit for office. Now he still says such nasty things and you hardly hear a word about it even after all that has transpired. Why? Because people have grown numb to it. And he was counting on that.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/05/24 03:14 PM
The Israeli military is preparing to immediately step up its strikes in the Gaza Strip to increase pressure on the Hamas terror group, which rules the coastal enclave, following its brutal October 7 assault on Israel.

IDF spokesman Rear Adm. Daniel Hagari said Saturday night that Israel was planning to enter “the next phase of the war in the best conditions [for us], not according to what anyone tells us.”

“From today, we are increasing the strikes and minimizing the danger,” Hagari said in a televised press conference.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/05/24 03:16 PM
Let's see if they follow through on the "minimize the danger" part.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/05/24 03:25 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Let's see if they follow through on the "minimize the danger" part.

That’s about all we can do. Watch.

I did see vids of the hospital ship off the coast and yes some children. But most of the patients I saw, fighting age Palestinian men.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/05/24 03:33 PM
I've been able to watch people such as ourselves help make important changes throughout my life when they ban together to make their voices known. Our nation and the world in general would look much differently today if all people thought they could do was watch. For one thing it's America that funds Israel's war machine. Putting contingencies on those funds could change things a lot. And if enough Americans apply enough political pressure it may be very doable. When it comes to innocent civilian deaths I don't make for a very good spectator. But once again even though we see this differently I understand why you feel that way.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/05/24 03:36 PM
Israel Gaza: What Gaza's death toll says about the war

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664

I'm not sure why you think a snapshot makes a movie. If we're going with "What I've seen", I've seen hospital wards filled with children. Anecdotal evidence doesn't tell a story.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/05/24 03:39 PM
The US supplies about 17% of Israel funding. Yeah it’s a lot but they have a lot. And can buy a lot. It would hurt but they aren’t going to fold to US.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/05/24 03:41 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Israel Gaza: What Gaza's death toll says about the war

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67764664

I'm not sure why you think a snapshot makes a movie. If we're going with "What I've seen", I've seen hospital wards filled with children. Anecdotal evidence doesn't tell a story.

Calm down. I just posted what I saw. I know it’s a snippet of the whole story. Geez.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/05/24 03:56 PM
https://www.timesofisrael.com/blink...h-israel-arab-allies-on-wars-next-phase/

Blinken heads to Mideast for talks with Israel, Arab allies on war’s ‘next phase’
Top US diplomat to visit multiple countries in region, push Israel on aid to Palestinians and on allowing Gazans to return to homes in north, as tensions rise post-Arouri killing

US Secretary of State Antony Blinken was traveling to the Middle East on Thursday for a series of consultations amid a resurgence in fears that the Israel-Hamas war will devolve into a larger regional conflict.

State Department spokesman Matt Miller said the secretary would make stops in Turkey, Greece, Jordan, Qatar, the United Arab Emirates, Saudi Arabia, Israel, the West Bank and Egypt. This will be Blinken’s fourth trip to the Middle East since Hamas’s brutal October 7 onslaught triggered the war in Gaza.

Blinken was originally slated to arrive in Israel at the end of this week, but on Tuesday delayed his arrival to early next week.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/05/24 04:25 PM
Originally Posted by PerfectSpiral
Calm down.

I have no idea why you think I'm not calm? Nobody is yelling at you.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/05/24 07:23 PM
Strike kills 12 people, mostly children, in Gaza area declared safe by Israel

https://www.pbs.org/newshour/world/...Hb_BvevQnVfBH3hqz3vhh_LTX6SF-LyF6SOsp9eg
Posted By: Ballpeen Re: Israel at war again. - 01/05/24 10:03 PM
Maybe everybody should claim a side. Not that everything is perfect with the claimed side, but overall...who sides with who? There is no neutral, so claiming that is the punks way out.

I am with Isarael.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 01/05/24 11:08 PM
Doesn’t matter what any of us think about this crap, we aren’t going to change a thing ragging on each other in DT about it.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/06/24 02:12 PM
“Israel’s offensive has focused on Khan Younis, where the military said Thursday it has uncovered tunnels used by Hamas and battled fighters from the militant group that attacked into southern Israel on Oct. 7.

Israel has vowed to continue its campaign in Gaza until Hamas is destroyed.”
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/06/24 03:37 PM
Originally Posted by Ballpeen
Maybe everybody should claim a side. Not that everything is perfect with the claimed side, but overall...who sides with who? There is no neutral, so claiming that is the punks way out.

I am with Isarael.

I'm on the side of innocent civilians no matter where they are. In Israel, Gaza, Africa or elsewhere.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/06/24 06:50 PM
Innocent Ukrainians don’t get a mention in your crusade?
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/06/24 07:12 PM
Not in a thread about Israel. But yes, they're being slaughtered too. The only difference I see is nobody is making excuse why it's okay for Russia to slaughter them.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/07/24 02:50 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Not in a thread about Israel. But yes, they're being slaughtered too. The only difference I see is nobody is making excuse why it's okay for Russia to slaughter them.
Yes they are. China, Iran, North Korea, and probably a host of other countries, and who exactly are these people you consistently speak of making excuses for slaughtering innocent civilians?
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/07/24 03:44 PM
In this thread? If you haven't been paying attention to your own posts don't blame me for it.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/07/24 04:03 PM
Ok bro. blame me for the way israel fight their war. I’m good. I don’t claim to know it all. I’ve only stated what I’ve seen and read in news. I haven’t picked a side, but I know who started the bloodshed and slaughter. And that’s the unfortunate price all of Gaza and all of Israel must pay now. War.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/07/24 04:22 PM
And there it is yet again. "I know who started it". I've shown you that they're using 2000 lb. bombs which are not needed and destroy everything within 1000 feet in every direction. Choosing to use that type of bomb specifically, purposefully causes mass civilian casualties. We haven't used those kind of bombs since Vietnam. I've shown that they leveled over 40% of all residential neighborhoods. Your response? "Yeah but Hamas started it."

No you're not responsible for the way Israel is fighting their war. You're only responsible for your response to it. We both agree on the objective here. The objective is to destroy Hamas. Even though as everyone can see with ISIS, you can destroy a military force but not an ideology. It will rise again. But for now Israel needs to wipe out the terrorist threat on its border. So we are lockstep there. The only real difference is I'm not going to sit here and give them carte blanche on the cruelty and purposeful slaughter of innocent civilians.

And we saw what Peen tried to do. He is the type of guy who was like "Declare which side your on. I'm on Israel's side." That same moronic attitude that suggests if you want one side to win you should excuse every action they take. It's all too common these days.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/07/24 04:43 PM
So the USA dropping a big one on Japan is inexcusable in your eyes.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/07/24 05:04 PM
I think a lot of factors should be considered. I understand why the Unites States did that but I highly doubt I would have made the same decision. And that's the thing about history. We're supposed to learn from it not make excuses to repeat it. Just like the U.S. learned not to use 2000 lb. bombs in Vietnam. Hamas is not Japan because they are not some major power. Hamas forces are low in numbers especially compared to Israel. Between active military personnel and reservists Israel has over ten times the troop strength. When it comes to military hardware Israel has an extensive and advanced arsenal which dwarfs Hamas.

I know trying to make a comparison out of things that have no correlation is a great bait and switch con game but your comparison simply holds no merit.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/07/24 05:26 PM
Actually I wasn’t asking you a question.

Hamas is the major power in Gaza. They attacked Israel with Palestinian soldiers. They Slaughter, murder, torture hostages in the streets of Gaza. Palestinian soldiers run home or go hiding among innocent civilians. They hide under schools, hospitals, and other civilian infrastructure. They tell innocent civilians they cannot leave or try to move. They are also now hostages held by their own people. Palestinians is the fighting force of Hamas, while their leaders hide away in other countries
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/07/24 05:34 PM
And who is it exactly that's telling you all of this? This is what happens when the only information people believe is the side they want to win. And how does that excuse bombing their entire families and everyone else within a 1000 feet radius? That last part id what I'm most interested in. You see Israel claims it's only targeting Hamas. I've shown you that's simply not true. Yet here you are talking about everything but that.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/07/24 11:50 PM
I saw Palestinian men attacking, murdering, torturing and parading Israeli hostages through the streets of Gaza. Didn’t you? I saw the cash of weapons they hid under a hospital. Didn’t you. I guess you didn’t or you wouldn’t have asked. But go ahead and continue to excuse hamas’s and their Palestinian soldiers for hiding behind innocent civilians like the cowards they are.
Posted By: hitt Re: Israel at war again. - 01/08/24 02:22 AM
PitDAWG- you reside in Tenn.- please inform all of us your access to Israeli intelligence, their military planning, their interface system between boots on the ground and Israeli aircraft and training for Gaza campaign. Your whole point seems rooted in tragic civilian deaths. Are you familiar with type of 2000lb bombs they are using, their fusing, you're positive sitting in Tenn. the blast radius is 1000 ft- could it be 800- have you actual seen the civilian casualties and verified they were indeed non-combatants- is a child strapped with a bomb, who walks into group of Israeli soldiers a "civilian"....are hospitals with major military targets under them exempt from targeting because you think they shouldn't be----the Mideast conflict isn't using US standards and never will- you know little in Tenn.-----compared to what the combatants know. I hate us, human beings killing each other----worrying about Gaza's great---what's your fix for daily killings in Chicago or Good Old US of A?
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/08/24 02:03 PM
He seems to know it all, but doesn’t accept the simple fact that Palestinians make up most of Hamas. Hamas is the governing body of Gaza. When they decided to attack Israel and take hostages they put everyone in Gaza in harms way and they didn’t care and carried it out anyway. Gaza is where they’re at because of Hamas not Israel. All the US can do is ask them to let in humanitarian aid. But he needs to blame someone here for excusing Israel to make the point he thinks Israel is fighting dirty and targeting civilians. They’re targeting Hamas fighters, not civilians. Palestinians hiding amongst their own, placing their own families in harms way, then calling foul when they are injured or killed. Pfft cowards.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/08/24 02:46 PM
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]


https://www.washingtoninstitute.org/media/3416

Hamas = Palestine
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/08/24 04:20 PM
Why are you being so obtuse? You haven't seen the film of these children being killed and wounded all over Gaza? The hospitals overrun with women and children?

And the information on the blast radius of those bombs is easily obtained. It's not some government secret. It explains the difference between the blasts of 500 lb. bombs verses 2000 lb. bombs much the way I have done in this thread.

Explosive weapons with large destructive radius: air-dropped bombs (the Mark 80 series and Paveway attachments)

https://aoav.org.uk/2016/large-dest...-mark-80-series-and-paveway-attachments/

America is not bombing civilian neighborhoods in Chicago. Which is exactly what Israel is doing in Gaza. I've seen zero examples of any "children strapped with bombs going up to Israeli troops in Gaza. Get that BS ot of here. lol

And Perfect, as has been explained to you, you don't have to "know everything" to have a basic grasp on what's going on. So once Hamas attacked Israeli citizens it made every woman and child in Gaza fair game? More excuses to slaughter innocent women and children.

You are doing nothing more than repeating Israel's war time propaganda while ignoring the facts.







Hamas isn't who has decided to use 2000 lb. bombs that they know will kill all of these women and children. Israel is.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/08/24 06:39 PM
So Pitt, you couldn’t have read the military performance of the Hamas Palestinian Islamic resistance movement I posted. Figures. Keep ignoring the fact that Palestinians = Hamas. All of them. Their leaders are Palestinian, their soldier’s are Palestinians, bombs also Palestinian produced in Gaza. Keep making excuses for Palestinians leaders who brought this upon their own innocent civilians that they go hide behind. Read the link bro, you may learn a thing or two.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/08/24 07:03 PM
I'm not sure what you think the opinion piece of two writers from this group have to do with anything because that's all it is.

I guess according to the picture you posted that makes it perfectly fine to drop bombs that will blast anything that within a 1000 feet radius in every direction. That opinion BTW was from 2009. They haven't been allowed to hold en election since 2006. I guess of course labeling all Palestinian people, including women and children as Hamas is one way to make yourself feel better about the human carnage of all those women and children. What ever it takes to make yourself feel better I suppose.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/08/24 07:48 PM
WHO Axes Medical Aid Delivery to North Gaza in Absence of Security Guarantees

GENEVA (Reuters) -The World Health Organization (WHO) said it had been compelled to cancel a mission to bring medical supplies to northern Gaza on Sunday after failing to receive security guarantees.

It was the fourth time WHO had had to call off a planned mission to bring urgently needed medical supplies to Al-Awda Hospital and the central drug store in northern Gaza since Dec. 26, it said.

"It has now been 12 days since we were last able to reach northern Gaza," the WHO office in the occupied Palestinian territories wrote on the X social media platform.

"Heavy bombardment, movement restrictions, and interrupted communications are making it nearly impossible to deliver medical supplies regularly and safely across Gaza, particularly in the north."

The delivery planned on Sunday, WHO said, had been designed to sustain the operations of five hospitals in the northern part of the enclave.

Israeli government spokesperson Eylon Levy said he did not have information on WHO's assertion, referring questions to the Israel Defence Forces.

WHO Director-General Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus said he was "shocked by the scale of health needs and devastation in northern Gaza".

"Further delays will lead to more death and suffering for far too many people," he wrote on X.

In separate comments, the International Rescue Committee aid group said its emergency medical team and the Medical Aid for Palestinians charity had been forced to withdraw and cease its activities at the Al-Aqsa Hospital in Gaza's Middle Area due to increasing Israel military activity in the area.

The Israeli offensive launched in the wake of a deadly rampage by Hamas in southern Israel on Oct. 7 has displaced most of Gaza's 2.3 million population, left many homes and civilian infrastructure in ruins, and caused acute shortages of food, water and medicine.

https://www.usnews.com/news/world/a...s-to-north-gaza-due-to-unsafe-conditions
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/08/24 08:50 PM
Lol…you didn’t read the report.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/08/24 08:57 PM
Sure I did. It was an opinion piece by two writers from almost 15 years ago. Like I said, if that makes you feel better about killing so many innocent women and children so be it. Somehow you think that makes it all relevant, facts and it all applies to today. That doesn't pass the sniff test.

How does that excuse using 2000 lb. bombs? How does that excuse cutting off food, water and medical supplies to everyone in Gaza? You keep dancing around those topics like your pants are on fire.
Posted By: archbolddawg Re: Israel at war again. - 01/08/24 09:24 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Sure I did. It was an opinion piece by two writers from almost 15 years ago. Like I said, if that makes you feel better about killing so many innocent women and children so be it. Somehow you think that makes it all relevant, facts and it all applies to today. That doesn't pass the sniff test.

How does that excuse using 2000 lb. bombs? How does that excuse cutting off food, water and medical supplies to everyone in Gaza? You keep dancing around those topics like your pants are on fire.


Did, over the years, hamas use "smart" rockets? Or did they just launch rockets directed at Israel willy nilly?
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/08/24 09:50 PM
So is it then your reasoning that since Hamas, who lacks any guided weapons system at all and lobs the only weapons they have at Israel, that excuses Israel's actions? I'll tell you another thing Hamas lacks, anything close to a 2000 lb. bomb that destroys everything with in a 1000 feet radius. You do understand that trying to make excuses why Israel has the right to act no differently than a terrorist organization is not a good look, right?

Israel has a modernized military which Hamas lacks. It's troop strength is over 10 times that of Hamas. Israel has a variety of bombs which it can choose from to use. They are one of the top modernized military's in that part of the world. Hamas is a rag tag operation by comparison. Hamas doesn't have any "smart rockets". Israel is purposely using bombs that inflict as much damage over a large area as possible. That's a choice, not a necessity.

Why is it so hard for people to simply admit that Israel has the option to use weapons that would reduce civilian deaths and casualties and as such they should do so? Because they do and they should. This isn't a complicated situation. If you can accomplish your mission while killing far less women and children you should do so. It's very rare you see what are supposed to be compassionate Christians among others make excuses for such an unnecessary slaughter. But then after what I've witnessed over the past decade I suppose nothing should surprise me at this point.
Posted By: archbolddawg Re: Israel at war again. - 01/08/24 09:57 PM
After decades and more of of random attacks on innocents, maybe you get pissed off?

After decades and more of hamas hiding behind civilians, you get pissed off?


I don't know - you are the all knowing one with all the answers.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/08/24 10:01 PM
Originally Posted by archbolddawg
After decades and more of of random attacks on innocents, maybe you get pissed off?

After decades and more of hamas hiding behind civilians, you get pissed off?


I don't know - you are the all knowing one with all the answers.

I just have a basic understanding of what's going on unlike you who just randomly post inane things.

I guess if one gets tired of his next door neighbor for taking pot shots at him it would be perfectly fine to blow up his house along with his entire family with a bomb. I mean you know, because you're pissed off. I'm sure that defense would work in court.
Posted By: archbolddawg Re: Israel at war again. - 01/08/24 10:05 PM
You're so out of it you have almost made this forum unreadable.

So, it's not hamas' fault they don't have laser guided and smart bombs? They should be able to just launch whatever they want, whenever they want? Maybe they should talk to the people/countries that fund them?
Posted By: EveDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 01/08/24 10:21 PM
Palestinians started a war and got their asses kicked. Pit cries about it. Here's a hankie.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/08/24 10:22 PM
Let me tell you whose fault it's not. It's not the fault of the women and children of Gaza. The funny part about all of this is that I'm actually for Israel wiping out Hamas. I have never upheld Hamas. The end goal that you want is the same end goal that I want. The only real difference is I understand that using 2000 lb. bombs to inflict the most civilian casualties as possible is wrong. A modern military with a vast variety of weaponry to choose from should not be purposefully using weapons that will inflict major damage in residential areas to kill and maim civilians. You on the on the other hand seem to think that's perfectly fine.

Once again, Hamas is NOT the innocent women and children in Gaza. Which is no different than Hamas killing innocent Israeli civilians which is not part of the Israeli military or government. I'm not a part of the two wrongs makes a right crowd. I was taught better than that while I was growing up.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/08/24 10:23 PM
Originally Posted by EveDawg
Palestinians started a war and got their asses kicked. Pit cries about it. Here's a hankie.

Hamas started a war. You're welcome. Here's you sign.
Posted By: EveDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 01/08/24 10:30 PM
Thats like saying the USA military are not Americans.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/09/24 02:41 PM
Quote
Israel has a modernized military which Hamas lacks

Maybe Hamas and their Palestinian soldiers that attacked Israel should have thought about that little tid bit before they carried out their plan.

When will you stop making excuses for Palestinian soldiers hiding behind and under Palestinian civilians with their bombs and weapons?

And if you think the study I posted is an opinion piece you’re full of it. The study was conducted to show the performance of the Palestinian Army over the years. Facts not opinions. But that’s all you have now, disclaimers, and how Hamas isn’t made up of Palestinians. Wake up. This has been going on for years as the study shows, they are all the same, they are one. Israel says no more. And that’s not picking sides, it’s the facts.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/09/24 04:07 PM
Originally Posted by EveDawg
Thats like saying the USA military are not Americans.

What it's saying is that all Americans do not go along with what the government is doing. That not all Americans are aiding the government. That Americans women and children aren't attacking a foreign country. It's not complicated.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/09/24 04:14 PM
Originally Posted by PerfectSpiral
When will you stop making excuses for Palestinian soldiers hiding behind and under Palestinian civilians with their bombs and weapons?

As we have seen in both strikes in Lebanon Israel is quite capable of locating a target, taking out that target without huge casualties. They aren't wiping out civilians in order to accomplish that. They could also greatly cut down on civilian casualties in Gaza. I'm not making excuses. I'm saying that Israel has a very capable and modern military and has chosen to use Vietnam era 2000 lb. dumb bombs to wipe out large areas of where mainly civilians live rather than targeted strikes.

Quote
And if you think the study I posted is an opinion piece you’re full of it. The study was conducted to show the performance of the Palestinian Army over the years. Facts not opinions. But that’s all you have now, disclaimers, and how Hamas isn’t made up of Palestinians. Wake up. This has been going on for years as the study shows, they are all the same, they are one. Israel says no more. And that’s not picking sides, it’s the facts.

No, despite your bluster, the women and children of Gaza are not enemy combatants. Try to stay on topic.
Posted By: EveDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 01/09/24 06:06 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Originally Posted by EveDawg
Palestinians started a war and got their asses kicked. Pit cries about it. Here's a hankie.

Hamas started a war. You're welcome. Here's you sign.

You are losing a lot of arguments today. Hamas is made of Palestinians. Palestinians started a war.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/09/24 06:10 PM
The military arm in Gaza, Hamas started the war. Unless you think the women and children of Gaza are Hamas your flailing at the wind. That's like saying if America starts a war somehow the children and the women of America are partly responsible for that. They're not. That's been the entire issue here throughout the thread. Take the L and deal with it.
Posted By: EveDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 01/09/24 07:18 PM
Palestinians started a war and got their asses kicked. Pit cries about it. Here's a hankie.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/09/24 07:36 PM
Originally Posted by EveDawg
Palestinians started a war and got their asses kicked. Pit cries about it. Here's a hankie.

Why am I not surprised this would be your reaction to thousands upon thousands of innocent women and children being slaughtered. Murica! freedumb!
Posted By: Day of the Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 01/09/24 08:03 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Originally Posted by EveDawg
Palestinians started a war and got their asses kicked. Pit cries about it. Here's a hankie.

Why am I not surprised this would be your reaction to thousands upon thousands of innocent women and children being slaughtered. Murica! freedumb!

Cause she has grown tired of your Antisemitic rhetoric. Israel has a right to defend themselves. Jewish people have a right to live and not have their women abused, raped, held captive. Their babies tortured in front of their parents, body parts cut off, burnt alive, etc.... Hamas treated the Israeli people worse than animals. It demanded a serious response. Its sure exposed antisemites all around the globe. That is for sure.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/09/24 08:22 PM
There's nothing antisemitic about standing up for innocent women and children. You resort to typical labeling rhetoric because you ignore the human cost on both sides is more a reflection of you than me. The Israeli military is no more the Jewish people than the innocent civilians in Gaza are Hamas.

Excusing that any military anywhere uses 2000 lb. dumb bombs in civilian neighborhoods causing a huge toll on civilian lives is inhumane. Labeling me for your own inhumanity isn't a me problem. That's a you problem.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/10/24 11:58 AM
Excusing Hamas’s fighting force, Palestinian soldiers hiding behind Palestinian civilians once again IC. Shame on you. And you do know the only people that can stop all of this is Hamas’s Palestinian leaders right? Turn over the hostages and the bombs will stop coming in. And you do know why Hamas exists right? So their people (Palestinian, civilians, women and children) don’t pay the consequences of their actions. And now they run and hide behind them like the cowards they are. Stop excusing them.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/10/24 04:24 PM
"Palestinian leaders" ARE Hamas. The people of Gaza haven't had an election since 2006. I'm not excusing anything. Go in there and kill them. Identify their location and use 500 lb. bombs so you don't blow up everything within a 1000 feet radius in every direction. The purpose of war is to defeat your enemy not the civilian population.

Let me explain something to you. It's not the Israeli people making these decisions to wipe out the civilians in Gaza. It's Netanyahu. The man, who just like trump is currently under indictment. The same man who is trying to toss out their supreme courts final say on the law. Yet you and some others seem to sit here and justify this mans disgusting decision to use antiquated bombs that the U.S. hasn't used since Vietnam and that kills anything and everything including women and children rather than target Hamas. And you say shame on me?

I understand why some people do it because he is so much like trump. But you sticking up for this mans decision to wipe out women and children while claiming he's only after Hamas? I thought if anyone could see through such a thinly veiled masquerade you would be one of them.
Posted By: Day of the Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 01/10/24 05:09 PM
So, your Israel hate is political. You just don't like their Leader. So, let's support their enemy. Got it!
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/10/24 05:24 PM
The leader is the one making all of these decisions. He's been indicted and is trying to overthrow their supreme court. Netanyahu is not the people of Israel. As a matter of fact many Israeli's dislike Netanyahu and many of his decisions. I suppose you think they hate Israel too? Since you don't like Biden, does that mean you hate America? saywhat You must!

I don't think you even hear yourself sometimes.
Posted By: Day of the Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 01/10/24 05:41 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
The leader is the one making all of these decisions. He's been indicted and is trying to overthrow their supreme court. Netanyahu is not the people of Israel. As a matter of fact many Israeli's dislike Netanyahu and many of his decisions. I suppose you think they hate Israel too? Since you don't like Biden, does that mean you hate America? saywhat You must!

I don't think you even hear yourself sometimes.

Oh, I dislike Biden as President. If I were to tell him that face to face, he wouldn't remember that I said it 30 seconds after I said it. I am not naive enough to think he is even running this Country. What I do know is if we were attacked even if the President was someone, I did not like I would support their actions in defending the country. I also support our allies vs their enemies. Israel is an important ally of the United States. I sure would not condemn them for doing what they deem necessary to defend their own people. They have terrorist organizations surrounding their borders and they have to act in strength at all times. If they don't Hezbollah will invade, the Houthis will attack, Isis will attack, etc.... Get the point. And don't for 1 minutes think each of those terror organizations would not hit this country if they thought they could get away with it. With this weak administration I do worry about that.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/10/24 05:57 PM
Obviously you haven't been paying attention. I have and do support Israel defeating Hamas. I have said that all along. That is supporting Israel. That doesn't mean that I have to support a certain military method Netanyahu is using top accomplish that mission. It appears the only place we disagree is that you give Netanyahu carte blanche to purposefully target innocent Palestinian civilians and I don't.

I'm not blind to the cruelty and slaughter of innocent people while you find it easy to excuse.

I'm guessing you're probably one of those who said that if you don't support the war in Iraq you don't support the troops too because that's the exact same rationale you're using here. When in fact supporting that our troops come home safely so as not to risk their lives in a war we should never have been in in the first place is supporting our troops.

You think you have to blindly support everything someone does or you must hate them. That's some real warped thinking there.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/10/24 06:15 PM
I suppose these Israelis hate Israel too?

Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/10/24 07:42 PM
When are you going to accept Hamas leaders are Palestinians born in Gaza? We can go through them 1 by 1 if you like.

1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yahya_Sinwar

Palestinian Born in Gaza.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/10/24 07:59 PM
Of course they are. Just like every terrorist organization are born in other nations. Be it ISIS, Hezbollah, the Houthis or any of the others. It however does not mean everyone in that country support or are a part of that terrorist organization. There are 2.3 million people in Gaza while Hamas fighters number around 30k. I have no idea how that excuses the slaughter of innocent women and children in Gaza. Look, Netanyahu has made a clear choice to se 2000 lb. dumb bombs that he knows full well will kill mass civilians. He knows that the results of that is a continuation of killing thousands upon thousands of innocent civilians. He has choices that would greatly reduce those numbers but he chooses not to do so. That's not complicated.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 01/10/24 08:26 PM
He rules Israel, and he’s going to do whatever he does. But I just made the connection that if you brow beat enough people on DT about having a pro HAMAS stance like you… And I know you will say you are pro innocent people, pro not killing Palestinian kids, yada yada yada… All this back and forth on humanity and doing what’s right means nothing. The bad actors will still be in charge on both sides and the cycle will continue and many more will die.

I have numbed myself to the entire middle east situation. I don’t get the Muslim’s beliefs/culture. I know not all are Muslim but most are. Their base values I assume are just like ours, wanting to live in relative peace and prosperity. But not much beyond assuming that makes sense to me. Being an atheist makes it even harder for me to grasp. If I lived a million years, I can’t imagine a scenario where I call for people to die or be slaughtered simply for existing and being different. But in these radicalized Muslim groups, human lives of people like you or me MEAN NOTHING. These people behead innocents to make their point. So I have no issue with BB dropping Bombs until they re no more. BB wouldn’t behead me for existing. Am I choosing a side? NOPE. I have no dog in that fight. But that also means I’m not going to fight to stop what they are doing now.

I don’t have family, friends, or anyone I know or love in GAZA or Israel. It’s actually easy for me to be jaded against the terrorists, but like you it’s hard to witness the carnage against the innocents caught in the middle. But those innocents lives being snuffed out are not my responsibility, nor yours. They are the responsibility of HAMAS and Israel and if BB commits war crimes, the international community will deal with hm in time. Personally, I don’t think he is committing war crimes, but neither of us have all or even most of the facts on this. So, I’ll get worked up about that if and when it materializes. I’m damn sure not taking the word of HAMAS on anything after OCT 7th.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/10/24 08:30 PM
I’m not excusing anything here. Just stating facts you refuse to acknowledge. I saw a report on how doctors are now being forced to leave their patients at hospitals where Palestinian soldiers are hiding under in tunnels because Israeli ground forces are now moving in close on them. The patients they showed were once again fighting age Palestinians. Anyways heavy bombing is decreasing with ground forces closing in. The doctor they interviewed said the injuries are different now that the war is moving into a new phase. On a side note let’s see how the US handles the Houti attacks from Yemen in the Red Sea. Wonder if they’re cowards like Hamas/Palestinians and hide behind their innocent civilians.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/10/24 08:33 PM
What part of me wanting Israel to defeat Hamas are you having trouble comprehending? It appears you are in the crowd that is claiming all of the women and children of Gaza are Hamas. You sound like a republican.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 01/10/24 08:36 PM
I don’t care what I sound like, that’s how i feel. And everybody knows I’m no GOPer. But nice try!

You sound like Tlaib, Omar, and all the other anti-semites. But I know that’s not who you are and won’t go there. It’s easy as a leftie to get caught up in the feelings that OUR morals dictate on war and aggression. I know the people in GAZA are not all HAMAS loyalists, but I also know the vast majority of HAMAS in GAZA are Palestinians and most Palestinians in GAZA hate Israel and America. My stance is rational and warranted in that respect. Stand with our allies, back putting down the HAMAS terror threat, and wish like hell these people would work their crap out. What I won’t do is get tore up emotionally over things I can do NOTHING about.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/10/24 08:43 PM
Where are these reports? I know another guy who says "I've been hearing", "some people are saying". So "of fighting age" means they must be members of Hamas? Speaking of grasping at straws..........

Hundreds missing from Gaza’s Al-Aqsa Hos­pi­tal amid Israeli bombardment

WHO and UN officials say patients arrive every few minutes in central Gaza hospital operating with 30 percent of staff.

Hundreds of patients and staff are reported to be missing from Al-Aqsa Martyrs Hospital in central Gaza, which is struggling to cope amid intense air strikes across the enclave.

The majority of medical staff, as well as around 600 patients, have been forced to leave the complex to unknown locations with no information of their whereabouts, the World Health Organization (WHO) and the United Nations (UN) reported on Monday.

The two institutions note chaotic scenes as the remaining staff at the hospital continues to try to cope with an influx of injured people as “heavy Israeli bombardment from air, land, and sea intensified across much of the Gaza Strip”.

Staff from the WHO and the UN Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs (OCHA) visited the only functioning hospital in the governorate of Deir el-Balah in central Gaza on Sunday. They noted that intense bombing had driven many to seek medical help at Al-Aqsa.

The Ministry of Health in Gaza reports that 225 Palestinians were killed and 296 people injured due to Israeli attacks on January 5 – 7.

The officials said that large numbers of wounded were being treated by very few staff at the facility and called for more protection for medical centres.

The director of the hospital reported that because of increasing hostilities and ongoing evacuation orders, most local health workers and about 600 patients have been forced to leave the facility to unknown locations.

WHO official Sean Casey said that new patients were arriving at the hospital every few minutes, adding that due to evacuation orders and the dangerous situation, there were only five doctors left to oversee hundreds of emergency cases and casualties.

“It is really a chaotic scene. The hospital director just spoke to us, and he said his one request is that this hospital be protected, even though many of his staff have left,” Casey said.

“This hospital is currently operating with about 30 percent of the staff that it had just a few days ago. They are seeing, in some cases, hundreds of casualties every day in a small emergency department.”

Medical Aid for Palestinians (MAP) and the International Rescue Committee (IRC) stated that their emergency medical team had been forced to cease activities at the hospital and leave the facility, as a result of increasing Israeli military activity.

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024...-aqsa-hospital-patients-unknown-director

The vast majority of the report of facts in this article come from the WHO and the U.N. Not some slanted opinionated sources. And they are actually there on the ground and know what's going on.

Israel has said all along that there are hundreds of miles of tunnels that run under Gaza. They are everywhere.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/10/24 08:48 PM
Originally Posted by OldColdDawg
I don’t care what I sound like, that’s how i feel.

And you are exactly what it sounds like when people state "what they feel" rather than wrap their minds around the basic facts of the matter. For some reason I thought you would "feel" more for the innocent civilians of Gaza rather than the leader of Israel who is purposefully using 2000 lb. bombs to intentionally inflict as many civilian casualties against innocent women and children as possible but I was wrong about that.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/10/24 08:52 PM
It’s what I saw on CNN, I didn’t say they were Hamas combatants. But now that you brought that up, why would that be grasping at straws?
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/10/24 09:04 PM
Because it's nothing more than a general accusations based on nothing but age. Here's what it looks like when these 2000 lb. bombs destroy entire residential neighborhoods. There's nothing targeted about it accept to destroy an entire residential neighborhood. You'll have to watch it on youtube if you care enough to see it.



And here a building where the news organizations were staying.

Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/10/24 09:14 PM
A Times Investigation Tracked Israel’s Use of One of Its Most Destructive Bombs in South Gaza

During the first six weeks of the war in Gaza, Israel routinely used one of its biggest and most destructive bombs in areas it designated safe for civilians, according to an analysis of visual evidence by The New York Times.

The video investigation focuses on the use of 2,000-pound bombs in an area of southern Gaza where Israel had ordered civilians to move for safety. While bombs of that size are used by several Western militaries, munitions experts say they are almost never dropped by U.S. forces in densely populated areas anymore.

The Times programmed an artificial intelligence tool to scan satellite imagery of south Gaza for bomb craters. Times reporters manually reviewed the search results, looking for craters measuring roughly 40 feet across or larger. Munitions experts say typically only 2,000-pound bombs form craters of that size in Gaza’s light, sandy soil.

Ultimately, the investigation identified 208 craters in satellite imagery and drone footage. Because of limited satellite imagery and variations in a bomb’s effects, there are likely to have been many cases that were not captured. But the findings reveal that 2,000-pound bombs posed a pervasive threat to civilians seeking safety across south Gaza.

In response to questions about the bomb’s use in south Gaza, an Israeli military spokesman said in a statement to The Times that Israel’s priority was destroying Hamas and “questions of this kind will be looked into at a later stage.” The spokesman also said that the I.D.F. “takes feasible precautions to mitigate civilian harm.”

But U.S. officials have said that Israel should do more to reduce civilian casualties while fighting Hamas. The Pentagon increased shipments to Israel of smaller bombs that it considers better suited to urban environments like Gaza. Still, since October, the United States has also sent more than 5,000 MK-84 munitions — a type of 2,000-pound bomb.

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/12/21/world/middleeast/israel-gaza-bomb-investigation.html

I know, I know, none of that matters.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 01/10/24 09:22 PM
I’m glad you finally admit none of this matters.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/11/24 01:34 PM
You made your point numerous times. It hasn’t changed the fact that Palestinians make up the fighting force of Hamas. Where do you expect they will find and kill all of these Palestinian fighters? And who will grieve for them? Palestinians.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/11/24 01:40 PM
.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/11/24 02:35 PM
Nations across the globe are grieving for those innocent women and children. Many Americans included. Sadly to some it doesn't matter. They lump them in with Hamas and don't give a damn.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/13/24 03:17 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Nations across the globe are grieving for those innocent women and children. Many Americans included. Sadly to some it doesn't matter. They lump them in with Hamas and don't give a damn.
While nations across the globe have stood idly by watching millions of innocent Jews being slaughtered, gassed, tortured, raped and killed. That doesn’t seem to matter much to them at all either. They lump all Jews together, including innocent civilians and continue their crusade to kill all Jews. All of them including innocent women and children.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/13/24 04:34 PM
Hamas is guilty of that. When you excuse Israel for killing civilians all the while condemning Hamas for the exact same thing it rings rather hollow.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/14/24 04:30 PM
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/14/24 05:33 PM
Well that's 1000 out of 2.3 million people. It's a funny thing. During the BLM protests people tried to use isolated photos as examples of black violence. That all the left was a violent mob. Then you called it profiling and not accurate. Now you have decided to adopt that same strategy yourself. Funny how all it takes to change a person's strategy is dependent on the group of people involved.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 01/15/24 02:48 PM
Sometimes you sound like a HAMAS fanboy, the way you dismiss the horror of OCT. 7TH. I know you are no more pro hamas than me, but sometime you sound more like Omar or Tlaib than Pit.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/15/24 03:50 PM
Nobody is dismissing what happened on Oct. 7th. It's not my fault you can't wrap your mind around the fact that when Israel slaughters innocent civilians it's no different than when anyone else does it. The women and children of Gaza's life is no less valuable than the women and children of Israel. It's actually a rather simple concept.

And you are the one who has always stuck up for the squad, not me. Actually you have made feeble attempts to give me grief for it when I have spoken out against AOC. My how the colors have changed.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/17/24 05:55 PM
Quote
Nobody is dismissing what happened on Oct. 7th.

Sounds like someone is. Palestinians are still holding innocent Jews hostage. Still being tortured by their captors.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/17/24 06:07 PM
When you have to resort to comparing Israel to Hamas in order to excuse Israel's behavior that speaks volumes. Hamas is a terrorist organization.

I wonder how many of their own hostages Israel has killed with their 2000 lb. dumb bombs? What ever that number is they'll likely never tell us the truth about it. We already know they mistakenly shot and killed three of them. The crazy actions of Netanyahu are what you are supporting here. That's not the Israeli people. Oh that's right, to you they're the same thing.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/17/24 08:12 PM
Quote
I wonder how many of their own hostages Israel has killed with their 2000 lb. dumb bombs?
There wouldn’t be Jewish hostages if Palestinian fighters didn’t take them hostage. Gaza is where it’s at because of Palestinian leaders decided to start a war with Israel.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/17/24 08:14 PM
So that's your excuse now? That's what abusers sound like. "Well I wouldn't have hit her if she didn't make me mad."
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/17/24 08:54 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
So that's your excuse now? That's what abusers sound like. "Well I wouldn't have hit her if she didn't make me mad."


Lol yeah thats it. willynilly notallthere rolleyes
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/17/24 09:08 PM
"Hamas is making me kill our own hostages!" - Benjamin Netanyahu

Maybe that will make it clearer for you.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/17/24 09:13 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
"Hamas is making me kill our own hostages!" - Benjamin Netanyahu

Maybe that will make it clearer for you.

Maybe. And maybe Hamas could let the hostages go and help stop the war they started.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/26/24 04:18 PM
https://thehill.com/policy/internat...s-unrwa-allegations-hamas-attack-israel/


US halts funds for UN body over allegations staff involved in Hamas attacks on Israel

The Biden administration announced Friday it was pausing funds for the United Nations body responsible for Palestinian refugees over allegations that 12 of its staff were involved in Hamas’s Oct. 7 attacks against Israel.

Wow! serious allegations here. A United Nations body involved with the Oct 7 attacks. So we can assume any information coming out of this UN body isn’t entirely factual.
Posted By: Swish Re: Israel at war again. - 01/29/24 08:09 PM
Everybody and their mamma is popping off in the Middle East.

I’m starting to wonder if some of this crap is due to the fact that humans can’t imagine a world without chaos and war? Like…people get bored. It’s like the people in this country wanting a big revolution on the right and left, even though reality says we’re moving along just fine, as usual. People just need that chaos, cause it feels like something - good or bad - is actually happening.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 01/30/24 03:14 PM
IDK. This has PUTIN written all over it.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/30/24 03:50 PM
Originally Posted by PerfectSpiral
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
"Hamas is making me kill our own hostages!" - Benjamin Netanyahu

Maybe that will make it clearer for you.

Maybe. And maybe Hamas could let the hostages go and help stop the war they started.

I guess you didn't get the message. Netanyahu made it clear the mission is to destroy Hamas no matter if he gets the hostages back or not. Once you tell them that they have nothing to gain by giving the hostages back.
Posted By: dawglover05 Re: Israel at war again. - 01/30/24 05:45 PM
He might have something to do with it, but a lot of the Houthi stuff in the Middle East is disrupting Chinese trade and they're kinda pissed about it. I don't think he would encourage a lot of stuff that would piss them off.

I do think that it's mostly on Iran. There is quite a power vacuum in the surrounding areas. On the advantageous side to them, Iraq isn't as powerful as it was in opposition to them as when Saddam was in power. So they are trying to make a push to heavily influence Iraq, especially with us moving out. On the downside, Assad is not as powerful as he used to be in Syria, so they still have to do everything they can to prop him up. They are also trying to exert as much influence as they can in the widely-Sunni Arabian Peninsula with the Houthi group in Yemen.

I think they're also trying to keep their populace focused on the world outside the country, too. They've had a lot of internal strife over the past few years. On top of that, the Ayatollah is ailing and they may not want to make that or choosing his successor a focal point in light of all the internal unrest they're experiencing.

Put all that together in a pot, add to it they are already subsidizing Hamas and Hezbollah, and I find them to be the chief instigator of most of the garbage going on right now.
Posted By: Pdawg Re: Israel at war again. - 01/30/24 11:53 PM
Group of Democrats call on Blinken to provide answers on bypassing Congress to approve arms sales to Israel

By Jennifer Hansler, CNN
4 minute read
Updated 2:37 PM EST, Tue January 30, 2024
US Secretary of State Antony Blinken addresses a press conference in Tel Aviv on January 9, 2024, during his week-long trip aimed at calming tensions across the Middle East, amid continuing battles between Israel and the Palestinian militant group Hamas in Gaza. (Photo by Alberto PIZZOLI / AFP) (Photo by ALBERTO PIZZOLI/AFP via Getty Images)
US Secretary of State Antony Blinken addresses a press conference in Tel Aviv on January 9, 2024, during his week-long trip aimed at calming tensions across the Middle East, amid continuing battles between Israel and the Palestinian militant group Hamas in Gaza. (Photo by Alberto PIZZOLI / AFP) (Photo by ALBERTO PIZZOLI/AFP via Getty Images) Alberto Pizzoli/AFP/Getty Images
CNN

A group of 19 predominantly Democratic lawmakers is calling on Secretary of State Antony Blinken to provide answers about why he bypassed Congress last month to approve arms sales to Israel.

“It is essential for Congress to be able to conduct oversight of these arms transfers and determine whether they are consistent with humanitarian principles and U.S. law, and whether they advance or harm U.S. national security,” the lawmakers wrote in a letter dated Friday and obtained by CNN.


The top US diplomat made two emergency determinations in December to immediately approve the transfer hundreds of millions of dollars in military equipment to Israel. The first was transmitted to Congress in early December for more than 13,000 tanks shells; the second, in late December for “155mm ancillary items including fuzes, charges, and primers that make 155mm shells functional.”

The emergency determinations meant the administration was able to bypass the standard 20-day period that congressional committees are typically afforded to review such sales.

The letter to Blinken comes amid growing anger and calls by progressive lawmakers – several of whom signed on to the letter– to enact conditions on military aid to Israel as the humanitarian toll of the offensive in Gaza continues to mount. More than 26,000 people have been killed since the start of the offensive in October, the Hamas-controlled health ministry said, and hundreds of thousands have been internally displaced, according to the UN.

The administration’s staunch support for Israel’s war is becoming a serious political problem for President Joe Biden in an election year with many progressive Democrats, Muslim and younger voters deeply unhappy about how the president is handling the war.

The letter was signed by Independent Sen. Bernie Sanders, Democratic Sens. Elizabeth Warren, Jeff Merkley, and Peter Welch, and Democratic Reps. James McGovern, Earl Blumenauer, Joaquin Castro, Judy Chu, Raúl M. Grijalva, Pramila Jayapal, Barbara Lee, Betty McCollum, Chellie Pingree, Mark Pocan, Delia Ramirez, Jan Schakowsky, Jill Tokuda, Maxine Waters, and DC Delegate Eleanor Holmes Norton.


In their letter, the lawmakers noted the rarity of administrations using emergency declarations to immediately approve arms sales without congressional approval. They also referenced the standards under US policies, such as the Leahy Law, to not provide military assistance to security forces credibly accused of gross human rights violations.

“Use of a national emergency waiver does not exempt the U.S. government from assessing whether arms sales are consistent with” those standards, they wrote.

The lawmakers called on the State Department to provide answers to a series of questions “in order to assess whether these transfers are consistent with international humanitarian law.” The list includes questions about how the government determined “that an emergency existed to necessitate both immediate transfers to Israel,” why the administration believes “Israel needs and will use 155mm shells in their military campaign,” and any mitigation efforts put in place to curb civilian casualties.

They also asked whether the government has “conducted any Leahy Law vetting of Israeli forces since October 7” and if there were “any findings of credible information that forces committed gross violations of human rights.”

The lawmakers requested the answers by February 9.

“We appreciate that your administration has repeatedly urged the Israeli government to take additional steps to reduce civilian casualties. However, we are concerned that these transfers and the administration’s evasion of congressional oversight may be inconsistent with broader U.S. foreign policy goals,” read the letter.


“We are also troubled by the decision to provide equipment for 155mm shells, which over 30 U.S.-based civil society organizations warned poses ‘a grave risk to civilians’ and are ‘inherently indiscriminate’ when used in densely populated areas like Gaza,” the lawmakers wrote. “In addition to the civilian harm risks inherent to the nature of these weapons, we are concerned that the weapons the U.S. provides could be used in a manner that violates of U.S. policy and international law.”

State Department spokesperson Matt Miller on Tuesday pushed back on the idea that the Department bypassed Congress, saying it was “following the statute that Congress passed.” He also said the determinations were made “in consultation with leading members of Congress.”

“We always welcome engagement with Congress and we will engage with them on this question, as we always do. I would say that the process that the secretary followed and the process that we follow here at the State Department is the process that the law actually prescribed,” Miller said at a State Department briefing.

Asked about the first emergency determination in early December, Blinken said that “when it comes to the weapons that we transfer, the rules that go along with them, those rules apply to Israel as they do to any other country, including the way they’re used and the need, the imperative of respecting international humanitarian law.”

“We want to make sure that Israel has what it needs to defend itself against Hamas,” he said on ABC’s “This Week” at the time. “A small portion of what has been requested is going through on an emergency basis, that is moving quickly so that Israel can have what it needs in hand. But virtually everything else is going through the regular order, through Congress. It’s very important that Congress’s voice be heard in this.”

https://www.cnn.com/2024/01/30/politics/democrats-letter-blinken-israel-arms-sale/index.html
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 01/31/24 12:22 AM
Originally Posted by Swish
Everybody and their mamma is popping off in the Middle East.

I’m starting to wonder if some of this crap is due to the fact that humans can’t imagine a world without chaos and war? Like…people get bored. It’s like the people in this country wanting a big revolution on the right and left, even though reality says we’re moving along just fine, as usual. People just need that chaos, cause it feels like something - good or bad - is actually happening.

I think it’s all a symptom of the misinformation on the right. The left is at a breaking point with the right for all the anti american bs. The right is just nuts, has lost it’s way, is transforming from the second party in a two party system to a cult of hatred that 67% of Americans do not like.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 01/31/24 12:25 AM
Originally Posted by OldColdDawg
Originally Posted by Swish
Everybody and their mamma is popping off in the Middle East.

I’m starting to wonder if some of this crap is due to the fact that humans can’t imagine a world without chaos and war? Like…people get bored. It’s like the people in this country wanting a big revolution on the right and left, even though reality says we’re moving along just fine, as usual. People just need that chaos, cause it feels like something - good or bad - is actually happening.

I think it’s all a symptom of the misinformation on the right. The left is at a breaking point with the right for all the anti american bs. The right is just nuts, has lost it’s way, is transforming from the second party in a two party system to a cult of hatred that 67% of Americans do not like.

And around the world, Trump 2016 gave hope to all the dictators, theocracies, and asshat strongmen that a degradation of US power would help. Republicans delivered. And we’ve been fighting that battle since.
Posted By: Day of the Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 01/31/24 08:28 PM
OCD You could not be further from the truth. Like Trump or hate Trump it does not matter he was a strong leader. When America is strong you don't see foreign Countries doing stupid things. Biden is weak. Elections have consequences. We elected a weak leader and players on the world stage have started to act up. Putin and Hamas took the opportunity to strike. North Korea, Iran, and China are moving closer to being bad actors on the world stage. The World needs a strong America. It needs a strong American president. Not some dope that can't speak straight, don't remember where he is, who he is with, and what time it is. Bows to the World Economic Forum and other globalists. And puts their interests ahead of American interest.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 01/31/24 08:35 PM
rofl

Is that you Putin?
Posted By: dawglover05 Re: Israel at war again. - 01/31/24 10:51 PM
I don't think I would disagree with the premise that administrations like Biden's and Obama's need(ed) to hold partners to task more for things like meeting their military budget pledges, and missed on moments to demonstrate a greater show of strength (red lines in Syria, for instance). To say that they didn't miss on some of those would be inaccurate.

When it comes to Trump, though, I'll just posit this question: "If your enemy is beating himself up, do you feel the need to attack him?"
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 02/01/24 01:28 AM
Originally Posted by Day of the Dawg
OCD You could not be further from the truth. Like Trump or hate Trump it does not matter he was a strong leader. When America is strong you don't see foreign Countries doing stupid things. Biden is weak. Elections have consequences. We elected a weak leader and players on the world stage have started to act up. Putin and Hamas took the opportunity to strike. North Korea, Iran, and China are moving closer to being bad actors on the world stage. The World needs a strong America. It needs a strong American president. Not some dope that can't speak straight, don't remember where he is, who he is with, and what time it is. Bows to the World Economic Forum and other globalists. And puts their interests ahead of American interest.

My advice to you is to rush out and get better gloves, because you’re losing your grip my man. Trump is a slug and a joke on the national stage. NOBODY takes him seriously. Nobody likes or is afraid of Trump the man. As potus he frightens everyone because he’s an imbecile man child with murderous traitorous fascist tendencies who has no idea how the world actually works. That person with nuclear weapons should terrify everyone, even idiots.

Oh, and Putin and the other dictatorial thugs, Trump’s boyfriends, will do anything to help reelect their useful idiot. Him being in the oval was like them getting the keys to the kingDUMB. Trump done more harm in four years than any other traitor in American history. He got his whole damn party to act attrocious and give up on their American principles and morals. I.e.- Ukraine and rooting for Putin. And you being ex military, of all people, should know how damned shameful and anti american that is.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 02/12/24 08:29 PM
IDF recover 2 hostages hidden by Hamas among civilians. 2 are back.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 02/12/24 08:41 PM
I wonder how many hostages they have killed with their own bombs? So they accidentally killed three of their own hostages....

Israeli troops killed hostages, mistaking their cries for help as ambush -military

https://www.reuters.com/world/middl...r-cries-help-ambush-military-2023-12-28/

And now they killed 67 Palestinians to rescue two hostages.

At least 67 Palestinians killed during dramatic Gaza raid to rescue 2 hostages

https://abc7news.com/israel-hostage-rescue-bombing-rafah-gaza-palestinians-killed/14414625/

You're one line claim doesn't quite tell the entire story.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 02/12/24 09:27 PM
It’s heartbreaking. Hamas holds the key to peace. Release the hostages.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 02/12/24 09:35 PM
That would be the right thing for them to do. However from a strategic standpoint once they do that they hold no leverage. Meanwhile innocent Palestinians are being slaughtered and the one slaughtering them is not Hamas.

And I know that no matter what Israel does in their attempt to defeat Hamas there most certainly will be civilian deaths. That's a given. But a modern military, which Israel most certainly is, has the ability to single out, seek and destroy its intended target while minimizing civilian casualties. I don't see any attempt to accomplish such an objective on the part of Israel.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 02/13/24 01:46 PM
Quote
and the one slaughtering them is not Hamas.



Actually they are, by putting them in harms way. Who hides brutalized hostages behind innocent civilians in a war they started? Israel is slaughtering Palestinian fighters. They claim a 1 to 1 casualty rate of one Palestinians fighter to one civilian loss. While Hamas leaders hide in Qatar, Syria, and Iraq. I’m not excusing what Israel has done but they won’t stop this until all the hostages are released or found. And there is little the rest of the world can do. It’s heartbreaking.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 02/13/24 02:09 PM
Quote
However from a strategic standpoint once they do that they hold no leverage.

Hamas will never hold leverage ever again. Israel will seek and destroy anyone related or fought with Hamas. They will kill them all over time. They did this with NAZI’s after the war. Very well documented. They also searched out and killed every member involved in the Munich massacre of the 1972 Olympics. Once again Palestinians at the spearhead. Palestinians have historically brought death and destruction upon themselves and their families. This isn’t anything new in the Middle East.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 02/13/24 05:04 PM
Actually if Israel were targeting Hamas as I have pointed out, they could isolate their whereabouts and target them without so many civilians casualties plain and simple. I've shown you ways for a long time now. I've shown you the antiquated bombs they are using that destroy everything within 1000 feet in every direction. The world sees it and the world knows it. No amount of excuses will change that.

You're right about them killing them all over time. And tens of, if not hundreds of thousands in the end will have no ties to Hamas. Just as we're seeing now. And you will most likely still be making excuses for it.

And you must have missed the memo from Netanyahu. He said he will not stop until Hamas is destroyed. Which is not related to the hostages return. Now we all just have to wait and see what his interpretation of Hamas being destroyed means. And then we'll just have to take his word for it, right? You know we have a guy here that's under indictment and trying to undermine the rule of law the same way Netanyahu is currently doing in Israel. How often do you take his word for things?
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 02/14/24 02:15 PM
Actually they do isolate their whereabouts. And when they do, they find out they’re hiding behind civilians. The raid to free the hostages last week had taken over a month to plan as to reduce the number of civilian casualties. We only see the snapshots the Palestinians want US to see. The numbers they want US to hear. I don’t believe everything I read or hear. Especially coming out of Gaza. I did see a confirmed video footage released this morning of the Palestinian Hamas leader escaping through a tunnel with his family in tow. Proving Palestinian/Hamas leaders travel with their families putting them in harms way. Innocent civilians related to Hamas. Their foot solders do the exact same thing, they put their own families in harms way. The video was recorded just a day or so after the deadly attack in Israel. And your continued rant that I’m excusing Israel for being a killing machine is ridiculous and a lie. Stating facts doesn’t equate into excuses.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 02/14/24 05:23 PM
Your facts must include killing tens of thousands of innocent civilians. It seems you claim not to trust Hamas yet many of the things I'm posting came directly from the WHO, Doctors Without Borders and humanitarian agencies. Instead you trust every word coming from Netanyahu's propaganda machine. Nobody's word seems to matter to you but his.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 02/15/24 02:09 PM
. Not really
Posted By: EveDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 02/16/24 05:18 AM
https://www.jpost.com/israel-hamas-war/article-787084

The UN says Hamas is not a terrorist group. Well, there goes their credibility.
Posted By: dawglover05 Re: Israel at war again. - 02/16/24 12:02 PM
If we’re completely honest, the UN is just the Security Council P5 members. Nothing matters unless all five of those countries agree. Right now, it’s 3 v 2 on the P5 and one of the two is becoming a vassal to the other.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 02/16/24 01:28 PM
Originally Posted by EveDawg
https://www.jpost.com/israel-hamas-war/article-787084

The UN says Hamas is not a terrorist group. Well, there goes their credibility.

Yeah no kidding. Not that the’ve had much credibility on this issue. Hamas is the governing body of Palestinian/Gaza. Palestinians make up the entirety of the fighting force. Palestinians have been terrorizing Israel for decades. Hamas = Palestine. Hamas = Terrorist.

And then there is this. A UN body!…… “The United States is extremely troubled by the allegations that twelve UNRWA employees may have been involved in the October 7 Hamas terrorist attack on Israel,” State Department spokesperson Matthew Miller said in a statement, referring to the United Nations Relief and Works Agency (UNRWA), a U.N. body dedicated to serving Palestinian refugees in the Gaza Strip.” More terrorists hiding behind civilians and refugees…..a UN body!
Posted By: Day of the Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 02/16/24 03:40 PM
Originally Posted by PerfectSpiral
Originally Posted by EveDawg
https://www.jpost.com/israel-hamas-war/article-787084

The UN says Hamas is not a terrorist group. Well, there goes their credibility.

Yeah no kidding. Not that the’ve had much credibility on this issue. Hamas is the governing body of Palestinian/Gaza. Palestinians make up the entirety of the fighting force. Palestinians have been terrorizing Israel for decades. Hamas = Palestine. Hamas = Terrorist.

And then there is this. A UN body!…… “The United States is extremely troubled by the allegations that twelve UNRWA employees may have been involved in the October 7 Hamas terrorist attack on Israel,” State Department spokesperson Matthew Miller said in a statement, referring to the United Nations Relief and Works Agency (UNRWA), a U.N. body dedicated to serving Palestinian refugees in the Gaza Strip.” More terrorists hiding behind civilians and refugees…..a UN body!

Make Gaza Great Again. End Hamas! End the two-state solution. Gaza is a part of Israel and should be governed by Israel. Israel is a sovereign Nation and should be able to govern its people and its border. The United States cannot govern our own border we have no right and neither does any other country have a right to tell Israel how to govern its country. The two-state solution has caused this conflict and Israel needs to end it.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 02/16/24 04:38 PM
Genocide is the answer?
Posted By: Day of the Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 02/16/24 04:42 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Genocide is the answer?

I never said Genocide. Gaza is part of Israel and Israeli government should be the governing force behind Gaza once this war is over. The two-state solution is wrong and caused this conflict.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 02/16/24 04:46 PM
So you think Israel trying to rule Gaza wouldn't create even more conflict?
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 02/16/24 05:24 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Genocide is the answer?
Not genocide….willynilly ….Genocide is what has been happening to Jews for a thousands years or more. Big difference.
Posted By: WooferDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 02/16/24 06:32 PM
Originally Posted by Day of the Dawg
Make Gaza Great Again. End Hamas! End the two-state solution. Gaza is a part of Israel and should be governed by Israel. Israel is a sovereign Nation and should be able to govern its people and its border. The United States cannot govern our own border we have no right and neither does any other country have a right to tell Israel how to govern its country. The two-state solution has caused this conflict and Israel needs to end it.

Well there is part of the rub, Israel is a sovereign nation, but it is not really a democratic nation, as Palestinians are not treated the same as Jewish. If it were a democratic nation, the Jewish would be in the minority. Hence, the political shenanigans that ultimately result in Palestinians being angry at Israel for not being democratic. Gaza is half state or something like that. It is the golden rule, those who have the gold, rule.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 02/16/24 08:06 PM
Originally Posted by PerfectSpiral
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Genocide is the answer?
Not genocide….willynilly ….Genocide is what has been happening to Jews for a thousands years or more. Big difference.

Then please explain what D of the D meant? And in case you missed it, "Israel" has not endured genocide and as of now has slaughtered over 30k Palestinian civilians. And that's a huge part of the problem here. Somehow society has convinced you that the actions of Netanyahu are somehow the actions of the Jewish people. They are not. That somehow Netanyahu is the face of past atrocities against the Jewish people. He is not. He is a crooked politician who is currently under indictment just like trump.

Do you think when trump separated families it represented the desires of even half of the American people? Don't confuse politicians or a political party with the nation's population. But then you do the same thing by acting like all Palestinians are Hamas so I guess it should be expected.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 02/29/24 05:07 PM
Palestinian deaths in Gaza pass 30,000 as witnesses say Israeli forces fire on crowd waiting for aid

RAFAH, Gaza Strip (AP) — Israeli troops fired on a large crowd of Palestinians racing to pull food off an aid convoy in Gaza City on Thursday, witnesses said. More than 100 people were killed, bringing the death toll since the start of the Israel-Hamas war to more than 30,000, according to health officials.

Israeli officials acknowledged that troops opened fire, saying they did so after the crowd approached in a threatening way. The officials insisted on anonymity to give details about what happened, after the military said in a statement that “dozens were killed and injured from pushing, trampling and being run over by the trucks.”

U.S. President Joe Biden said the United States was still trying to determine what happened in Gaza City. When asked if the loss of life would complicate efforts broker a cease-fire, he said, “I know it will.”

Gaza City and the surrounding areas in the enclave’s north were the first targets of Israel’s air, sea and ground offensive, launched in response to Hamas’ Oct. 7 attack.

While many Palestinians fled the Israeli invasion in the north, a few hundred thousand are believed to remain in the area, which has suffered widespread devastation and has been largely isolated during the conflict. Trucks carrying food reached northern Gaza this week, the first major aid delivery to the area in a month, officials said Wednesday.

Aid groups say it has become nearly impossible to deliver humanitarian assistance in most of Gaza because of the difficulty of coordinating with the Israeli military, ongoing hostilities and the breakdown of public order, with crowds of desperate people overwhelming aid convoys. The U.N. says a quarter of Gaza’s 2.3 million Palestinians face starvation; around 80% have fled their homes.

Kamel Abu Nahel, who was being treated for a gunshot wound at Shifa Hospital, said he and others went to the distribution point in the middle of the night because they heard there would be a delivery of food. “We’ve been eating animal feed for two months,” he said.

He said Israeli troops opened fire on the crowd as people pulled boxes of flour and canned goods off the trucks, causing them to scatter, with some hiding under cars. After the shooting stopped, people went back to the trucks, and the soldiers opened fire again. He was shot in the leg and fell over, and then a truck ran over his leg as it sped off, he said.

Saudi Arabia, Egypt, and Jordan accused Israel of targeting civilians in the incident. In separate statements, they called for increased safe passages for humanitarian aid and for the international community to take decisive action to pressure Israel to abide by international law and to reach an agreement for an immediate cease-fire.

Alaa Abu Daiya, a witness to the violence, said Israeli troops opened fire and also that a tank fired a shell.

Medics arriving at the scene on Thursday found “dozens or hundreds” lying on the ground, according to Fares Afana, the head of the ambulance service at Kamal Adwan Hospital. He said there were not enough ambulances to collect all the dead and wounded and that some were being brought to hospitals in donkey carts.

Another man in the crowd — who gave only his first name, Ahmad, as he was being treated at a hospital for gunshot wounds to the arm and leg — said he waited for two hours before someone with a horse-pulled cart had room to take him to Shifa.

Dr. Mohammed Salha, the acting director of the Al-Awda Hospital, said the facility received 161 wounded patients, most of whom appeared to have been shot. He said the hospital can perform only the most essential surgeries because it is running out of fuel to power emergency generators.

In addition to at least 112 people killed, around 760 were wounded, Health Ministry spokesman Ashraf al-Qidra said. The Health Ministry described it as a “massacre.”

Separately, the Health Ministry said the Palestinian death toll from the war has climbed to 30,035, with another 70,457 wounded. It does not differentiate between civilians and combatants in its figures but says women and children make up around two-thirds of those killed.

The ministry, which is part of the Hamas-run government in Gaza, maintains detailed records of casualties. Its counts from previous wars have largely matched those of the U.N., independent experts and even Israel’s own tallies.

The Hamas attack into southern Israel that ignited the war killed 1,200 people, mostly civilians, and the militants seized around 250 hostages. Hamas and other militants are still holding around 100 hostages and the remains of about 30 more, after releasing most of the other captives during a November cease-fire.

Violence has also surged across the West Bank since Oct. 7. An attacker shot and killed two Israelis at a gas station in the settlement of Eli on Thursday, according to the Israeli military. The attacker was killed, the military said.

The increasing alarm over hunger across Gaza has fueled international calls for another cease-fire, and the U.S., Egypt and Qatar are working to secure a deal between Israel and Hamas for a pause in fighting and the release of some of the hostages.

Mediators hope to reach an agreement before the Muslim holy month of Ramadan starts around March 10. But so far, Israel and Hamas have remained far apart in public on their demands.

In a statement condemning Thursday’s attack, Hamas said it would not allow the negotiations “to be a cover for the enemy to continue its crimes.”

Meanwhile, U.N. officials have warned of further mass casualties if Israel follows through on vows to attack the southernmost city of Rafah, where more than half of Gaza’s population of 2.3 million has taken refuge. They also say a Rafah offensive could decimate what remains of aid operations.

Hundreds of thousands Palestinians are believed to remain in northern Gaza despite Israeli orders to evacuate the area in October, and many have been reduced to eating animal fodder to survive. The U.N. says 1 in 6 children under 2 in the north suffer from acute malnutrition and wasting.

COGAT, the Israeli military body in charge of Palestinian civilian affairs, said around 50 aid trucks entered northern Gaza this week. It was unclear who delivered the aid. Some countries have meanwhile resorted to airdrops in recent days.

The World Food Program said earlier this month that it was pausing deliveries to the north because of the growing chaos, after desperate Palestinians emptied a convoy while it was en route.

Since launching its assault on Gaza following Hamas’ Oct. 7 attack, Israel has barred entry of food, water, medicine and other supplies except for a trickle of aid entering the south from Egypt at the Rafah crossing and Israel’s Kerem Shalom crossing. Despite international calls to allow in more aid, the number of supply trucks is far less than the 500 that came in daily before the war.

COGAT said Wednesday that Israel does not impose limits on the amount of aid entering. Israel has blamed U.N. agencies for the bottleneck, saying hundreds of trucks are waiting on the Palestinian side of Kerem Shalom for aid workers to collect them.

U.N. spokesman Stephane Dujarric on Wednesday countered by saying large trucks entering Gaza have to be unloaded and reloaded onto smaller ones. But there aren’t enough of them, and there’s a lack of security to distribute aid in Gaza.

Hamas-run police in Gaza stopped protecting convoys after Israeli strikes on them near the crossing.

https://thehill.com/homenews/ap/ap-...for-aid-in-gaza-kills-and-wounds-dozens/
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 03/02/24 04:52 PM
US dropped aid into Gaza, two officials confirm

The U.S. military has conducted food drops in Gaza authorized by President Joe Biden, according to two U.S. officials familiar with the operation.

The military is reported to have used three C-130 cargo planes from U.S. Air Forces Central Command to drop 66 parachute-strapped bundles containing about 38,000 meals over Gaza around 8 a.m. ET.

The air drop was expected to be the first of many the military planned to conduct. It came just days after many Palestinians were killed after trying to pull goods from an aid convoy.

https://abcnews.go.com/Internationa...OlHKTlScXUGEb2QD8qH1zcu2yT7ru-EwvupecHvM


Israel: Starvation Used as Weapon of War in Gaza

Evidence Indicates Civilians Deliberately Denied Access to Food, Water

https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/12/18/israel-starvation-used-weapon-war-gaza
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 03/05/24 06:01 PM
Number of children dying of dehydration, malnutrition in Gaza 'will skyrocket' without cease-fire: UNICEF

The situation is "deteriorating every hour" the UNICEF spokesman said.

The number of children in Gaza dying from dehydration and malnutrition "will skyrocket" if there is not a cease-fire, according to UNICEF spokesman James Elder.

Elder called the deaths of children from dehydration and malnutrition, which UNICEF said it is now witnessing inside Gaza, "entirely predictable," "man-made" and "preventable."

He described the levels of malnutrition among young children in the south of Gaza as "unacceptable and dangerous."

However, he said the levels of malnutrition and dehydration among children in the north of Gaza are "roughly three times higher" than in the south, because of the lower levels of humanitarian assistance that are reaching the northern parts of the strip.

UNICEF said its fear is that we will now start to see "a spiraling amount of deaths" among children, linked to malnutrition.

"Normally malnutrition is an underlying cause of death. A child will be killed by a disease. When we talk of hearing of children dying of dehydration, this is a great fear because this can lead to huge numbers of children dying very quickly," Elder told ABC News in an interview from Geneva.

Elder said children are now dying in Gaza because they are dehydrating because doctors are unable to get food into their bodies.

He described the level of suffering a child would go through in this scenario and called it "about as dark as it can get for a population."

The situation is "deteriorating every hour" the UNICEF spokesman said.

The fact that "world-class medical care" is "literally around the corner" but is inaccessible for these sick children is "darkly unique," he said.

Elder believes it is not too late to avert a humanitarian catastrophe but said "we are getting close to some kind of point of no return."

"If there was a cease-fire today, we would have an absolute humanitarian crisis at the highest scale that the UN would determine," Elder said.

He called the humanitarian picture "as bad as it's ever been" in Gaza.

In the Gaza Strip, at least 30,534 people have been killed and more than 71,000 others have been wounded by Israeli forces since Oct. 7, according to Gaza's Hamas-controlled Ministry of Health.

In Israel, at least 1,200 people have been killed and 6,900 others have been injured by Hamas and other Palestinian militants since Oct. 7, according to the Israeli officials.

https://abcnews.go.com/Internationa...97uGaDEeYUjY52imu0knBTQ3L3Sw0r3-Sq4DDfwM
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 03/07/24 04:11 PM
Newborns die of hunger and mothers struggle to feed their children as Israel’s siege condemns Gazans to starvation

Anwar Abdul Nabi perches on the edge of a bed at the Kamal Adwan Hospital in northern Gaza. Her eyes are sunken with grief.

The young mother tenderly holds the fingers of her daughter, Mila. Just minutes ago, the 3-year-old girl died of starvation.

“My daughter was taken into to God’s mercy, because of the lack of calcium, potassium and oxygen,” Nabi told CNN on Monday, as she cried into the arms of an elderly relative. “Suddenly, everything dropped, because she was not eating anything with iron, or eggs. She used to eat eggs every day before the war. Now nothing. She passed away.”

As Israel’s severe restrictions on aid entering the Gaza Strip drain essential supplies, displaced Palestinians told CNN they are struggling to feed their children. Starving mothers are unable to produce enough milk to breastfeed their babies, doctors say. Parents arrive at overwhelmed health facilities begging for infant formula. In northern Gaza, people rush to grab aid from infrequent humanitarian drops. Health workers say they cannot offer life-saving treatment to malnourished Gazans because Israel’s bombardment and siege has crushed the medical system.

The Ministry of Health in Gaza said Tuesday that since the beginning of the war, 364 health workers had been killed; 269 medical staff arrested; 155 health facilities “destroyed,” and 155 ambulances “targeted.” CNN cannot independently confirm the numbers due to the lack of international media access to Gaza.

Israel launched its military offensive in Gaza after the militant group Hamas killed at least 1,200 people and kidnapped more than 250 others in southern Israel on October 7.

Since then, Israel’s attacks on Gaza have killed at least 30,717 Palestinians and wounded another 72,156 people, according to the Ministry of Health in the enclave, while its siege has drastically diminished vital supplies and left the enclave’s population of some 2.2 million people exposed to high levels of acute food insecurity or worse, according to the Integrated Food Security and Nutrition Phase Classification (IPC), which assesses global food insecurity and malnutrition.

At least 20 Palestinians have starved to death in Gaza, Dr. Ashraf Al-Qudra, a spokesperson for the Ministry of Health, said on Wednesday. The youngest baby who died of starvation in the enclave was one day old, according to Dr. Hussam Abu Safiya, director of Kamal Adwan hospital. The true number could be even higher, as limited access to northern Gaza has hindered the ability of aid agencies to fully assess the situation there. UN experts accused Israel of “intentionally starving” Palestinians in Gaza. Israel insists there is “no limit” on the amount of aid that can enter Gaza, but its inspection regime on aid trucks has meant that only a tiny fraction of the amount of food and other supplies that used to enter Gaza daily before the war is getting in now.
Children, mothers at risk

One-year-old Watin, in northern Gaza, has grown tired and weak from dehydration. Instead of drinking baby formula, she is surviving on one to two dates a day.

“She is only taking one meal,” said her father, Ikhlas Shehadeh, who struggles to scavenge enough food to feed his baby girl. “She spent a long time without any milk. This child is suffering from the inability to move,” he told CNN on Tuesday. “We do not know what to do.”

The babies of thousands of women “who are due to give birth in the next month in the Gaza Strip are at risk of dying,” the UNICEF State of Palestine Humanitarian Situation report said on Tuesday. At least 5,500 pregnant women “do not have access to prenatal or postnatal check-ups because of bombings and need to flee for safety,” the report said.

“Anxiety is also leading to premature births,” the report added, citing the United Nations Population Fund (UNPF.) The report also said over 90% of children “aged 6-23 months and pregnant, breastfeeding women face severe food poverty with access to two or fewer food groups per day.”

Food shortages are reportedly the worst in northern Gaza, where Israel concentrated its military offensive in the early days of the war. Child malnutrition in the region is about three times higher than in southern Gaza, according to the World Health Organization (WHO). Screenings at health facilities there have previously found at least one in six children under the age of two are acutely malnourished, said Richard Peeperkorn, WHO representative for the territory. He warned those figures are “likely to be greater today.” Pregnant and breastfeeding women also face “grave threats to their health” caused by malnutrition, the Global Nutrition Cluster, an alliance of NGOs, reported in February.

Dr. Muhammad Salha, acting director of Al-Awda Hospital, in northern Gaza, told CNN medical workers are treating cases of dehydration, gastroenteritis, and hepatitis among women and children.

“There are babies who died in their mothers’ wombs, and surgeries were performed to remove the dead fetuses,” he said on Monday. “Mothers are not eating because of the conditions we are living in, and this affects the infants … There are causes of many children suffering from dehydration and malnutrition, leading to death.”

Israel’s bombardment has forcibly displaced at least 1.7 million Palestinians, according to the UN’s Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs. Many of those who fled the fighting are crammed into overwhelmed shelters without basic sanitation, leading to the spread of infections. Malnourished children, especially those with severe malnutrition, are at greater risk of dying from illnesses like diarrhea and pneumonia, according to the World Health Organization.

Another doctor in northern Gaza, Ahmad Salem, said patients in intensive care and neonatal units were dying from malnutrition and a lack of oxygen, which are difficult to administer amid fuel shortages. “We suffer from starvation of mothers,” the medical worker in the Kamal Adwan Hospital told CNN. “We cannot find an alternative to mother’s milk, which leads to the death of those children.”
‘We have become like dogs’

Footage obtained by CNN shows scores of desperate civilians clambering over each other to grab ration packs from aid drops in northern Gaza.

On Tuesday, the United Arab Emirates and Egypt sent 42 tons of medical supplies and food via airplanes in the region, the Emirati Ministry of Defense said. The US military said it had, alongside the Royal Jordanian Air Force, parachuted more than 36,800 meals into northern Gaza that day.

But human rights groups criticized the drops as inefficient and a degrading way of getting aid to Gazans, urging Israeli authorities to lift controls on land crossings into the enclave. Melanie Ward, the CEO of the UK-based NGO, Medical Aid for Palestinians, urged Israel to “immediately open all crossings into Gaza for aid workers to assist those in need.”

“Only safe and unfettered access for aid and aid workers, the lifting of the siege, and an immediate ceasefire can end starvation in Gaza,” she said in a statement on Saturday.

Even when aid does make it into the strip, collecting it can be dangerous.
Israeli forces opened fire on people waiting for aid on Monday in northern Gaza, eyewitnesses told CNN, in an incident that took place shortly before midnight at the Kuwait Roundabout on Rasheed Street in Gaza City. CNN has reached out to the Israel Defense Forces (IDF) for comment.

Last Thursday, at least 118 people were killed while trying to access food aid in Gaza City in one of the worst single tragedies of the war so far. Palestinian health officials said Israeli troops had used live fire as hungry and desperate Palestinian civilians were gathering around food trucks, with Riyad Mansour, the Palestinian ambassador to the United Nations, referring to the incident as an “outrageous massacre.” The Israeli military said it first opened fire with warning shots for crowd control, before firing on “looters” who came toward them. Most of the dead were killed by ramming as aid truck drivers tried to escape the gunfire and chaos, eyewitnesses and the IDF both said. CNN is unable to independently confirm the figures.

Faraj Abu Naji, whose sister gave birth to twin girls a week ago, managed to obtain just three cartons of milk for his newborn nieces in an aid drop in northern Gaza. He told CNN that he injured his foot while trying to buy flour along Al-Rashid Street.

“We thank God that there is humanitarian aid being dropped from Jordanian and Emirati planes,” he said on Tuesday. “I try as much as possible to obtain milk from the planes that drop aid so that we can provide milk for my nieces for as long as possible.

“Planes are dropping aid on northern Gaza, and we have become like dogs, running after a bone.”

https://www.cnn.com/2024/03/06/midd...AbEgPiGckphPdDWxVcAZRG98TXbwVQ4oD8D2LKsk

Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 03/07/24 09:52 PM
US to build temporary port to deliver Gaza aid

WASHINGTON, March 7 (Reuters) - President Joe Biden will announce in his State of the Union speech on Thursday that the U.S. military will construct a temporary port on Gaza's Mediterranean coast to receive humanitarian aid by sea, senior administration officials said.

Planning for the operation, initially based on the island of Cyprus, does not envisage the deployment of U.S. military personnel in Gaza, the officials told a news briefing.

The officials also said that Hamas is delaying a new deal with Israel on a six-week ceasefire and the release of hostages because the Islamists who rule Gaza have not agreed to free sick and elderly captives.
The deal "is on the table now and has been for more than the past week," said an official, referring to stalled negotiations in Egypt, adding that the temporary ceasefire is needed "to bring immediate relief to the people of Gaza."

Hamas blamed the stalemate on Israel's rejection of its demands to end its offensive and withdraw its forces.
Biden's decision to order the construction of the temporary port comes amid U.N. warnings of widespread famine among the enclave's 2.3 million Palestinians after nearly five months of fighting between Israeli troops and Hamas.

A staunch supporter of Israel, Biden faces rising political pressure to end the Israeli offensive, including a protest movement for Democratic voters to withhold their support for the president in his party primaries for November's general election.

Large swaths of Gaza have been destroyed and most of the population displaced by intense Israeli bombardments and fighting ignited by Hamas's Oct. 7 onslaught into Israel.
Israel says Hamas' incursion claimed 1,200 lives and saw the Islamists abduct 253 hostages. Gaza health officials say the number of people killed in the subsequent offensive launched by Israel has surpassed 30,800.

A PORT IN GAZA

Biden will tell Congress he is ordering the U.S. military "to undertake an emergency mission to establish a port in Gaza, working with like-minded countries and humanitarian partners," one official said.

The facility would accommodate large ships carrying food, water, medical supplies and temporary shelters.

Washington will work with European and regional partners and allies to build an international coalition of countries that would contribute capabilities and funds, the officials said.

An Israeli official said Israel “fully supports the deployment of a temporary dock” on Gaza’s coast and the operation “will be carried out with full coordination between the two parties.”

While Israel is increasing the number of aid-bearing trucks allowed into the besieged enclave and the United States and other countries have been airdropping supplies, the amounts of assistance getting in are insufficient, the official said.

"We're not waiting for the Israelis" to allow in more aid, the official continued. "This is a moment for American leadership."

The temporary port would increase humanitarian assistance to Palestinians in the war-battered enclave by "hundreds of additional truckloads" per day, the official said, adding that the United States would coordinate security with Israel.

It also would work with the U.N. and humanitarian aid organizations that "understand the distribution of assistance within Gaza," the official said.

The official said the operation would "take a number of weeks to plan and execute" and that the U.S. forces required for it are in the region or would soon begin moving there.

The U.S. operation would build on a Cypriot government initiative, which calls for collecting humanitarian aid in the island's port city of Larnaca, 210 nautical miles from Gaza, the officials said.
That would permit Israeli officials to screen shipments before they are transported to Gaza.

While the temporary port in Gaza would initially be a military-run operation, Washington envisions it becoming a commercially run facility, the official said.

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/bi...struction-state-union-speech-2024-03-07/
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 03/08/24 05:27 PM
I don’t see how US military fighting forces will not be required. That port is going to be a bullseye.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 03/08/24 05:36 PM
A bullseye for who? There have been no attacks by Hamas on the few aid trucks Israel does permit going into Gaza. I don't see any basis for what you are suggesting. The only one I think may take issue with it could be Israel. They seem to think starvation is a sound military tactic.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 03/08/24 05:58 PM
Israel will be inspecting every shipment. They should deliver the shipments in my opinion not the US. But you seem to want to vilify me for their actions, so I’ll just back out of here.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 03/08/24 06:10 PM
Israel has shown how they deliver humanitarian aid when it's left up to them. A fraction of what is needed which has led to mass shortages in both food and medical supplies. That's what has gotten this crisis to where it is now. They can no longer be trusted to deliver humanitarian aid to Gaza. If they could we wouldn't have to be building a temporary port to keep those people fed and with medical supplies. I don't believe that Israel will have the control over inspections like you think they will. That's the same tactic they've been sing to slow the aid down now.

And BTW- I said nothing to vilify you in my previous post. I simply asked you who you were referring to when you said this port would "be a bullseye". Which is the one thing you didn't address in your response.
Posted By: Swish Re: Israel at war again. - 03/08/24 08:35 PM
The body count itself says the response to the events of Oct. 7th were completely unhinged.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 03/08/24 09:36 PM
Posted By: dawglover05 Re: Israel at war again. - 03/08/24 10:23 PM
Originally Posted by Swish
The body count itself says the response to the events of Oct. 7th were completely unhinged.

I actually expected something this severe. Not saying that it's not unhinged, just that it was the perfect storm, given everything going on with Netanyahu.
Posted By: mgh888 Re: Israel at war again. - 03/09/24 11:57 AM
Originally Posted by dawglover05
Originally Posted by Swish
The body count itself says the response to the events of Oct. 7th were completely unhinged.

I actually expected something this severe. Not saying that it's not unhinged, just that it was the perfect storm, given everything going on with Netanyahu.

Agree - Netanyahu having failed to protect his citizens was always going to look for retribution and go overboard with any response. I expected the same - but I didn't expect that in March children in Gaza would still be dying and especially not from malnutition because Isreal is commiting war crimes whether anyone wants to admit it or not.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...on-dehydration-gaza-israel-b2506855.html
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 03/09/24 04:51 PM
Aid ship for Gaza expected to depart Cyprus this weekend

LARNACA, Cyprus, March 9 (Reuters) - A ship laden with relief supplies for Gaza was preparing to depart Cyprus on Saturday as part of efforts to aid a population on the brink of famine.
The European Commission has said a maritime aid corridor between Cyprus and Gaza could start operating as early as this weekend in a pilot project run by an international charity and financed by the UAE.

The Open Arms, a vessel owned by a Spanish NGO and more accustomed to rescuing migrants at sea, was expected to be deployed in the first mission. It was still at the port of Larnaca in Cyprus on Saturday afternoon, live images from Reuters TV showed, and authorities could not give a precise departure time.

Cyprus lies about 210 miles north-west of Gaza, or about 15 hours sailing time.

Separately, the United States has said it plans to build a temporary jetty to bring aid into Gaza, which has no port infrastructure. It too plans to initially use Cyprus, which is offering a process for screening cargoes which will include Israel officials, removing the need for security checks in Gaza.

Negotiations on a possible ceasefire in Israel's war against Hamas remain deadlocked.

Pallets of rice, flour and protein were being loaded in Larnaca on Saturday in an operation organised by the World Central Kitchen (WCK) charity and mostly funded by the UAE
.
Aid agencies have warned of a looming famine five months into Israel's campaign against Hamas. Most of Gaza's 2.3 million inhabitants are now internally displaced, with severe bottlenecks in aid deliveries at land border checkpoints.

A sea corridor from Cyprus will supplement attempts to boost aid supplies, which have included airdrops of food.

The charity WCK has partnered with Spain's Proactiva Open Arms and is sourcing the food.

"WCK and partners agree more than one ship will be needed and are working towards a constant flow of aid," it said in a statement, adding that another 500 tonnes of aid was ready to follow the initial shipment.

A spokesperson for WCK said the intention was to sail to Gaza, where WCK and partners were building a jetty. It was not related to the U.S. jetty project.

Gaza has been under an Israeli navy blockade since 2007, when Hamas took control of the enclave. There have been few direct sea arrivals since then. Larnaca port was used by pro-Palestinian activists, who used small sail boats to get into Gaza harbour in 2008.

https://www.reuters.com/world/middl...d-depart-cyprus-this-weekend-2024-03-09/

Chef José Andrés started World Central Kitchen. It feeds starving people all over the globe no matter where they exist. Where people are hungry, they are there.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 03/18/24 08:14 PM
‘Famine is imminent’ in northern Gaza with 70 percent of people experiencing catastrophic hunger, UN says

RAFAH, Gaza Strip (AP) — The U.N. food agency said Monday that “famine is imminent” in northern Gaza, where 70% of the remaining population is experiencing catastrophic hunger, and that a further escalation of the war could push around half of Gaza’s total population to the brink of starvation.

The alarming report came as Israel faces mounting pressure from even its closest allies to streamline the entry of aid into the Gaza Strip and open more crossings. The European Union’s top diplomat said the impending famine was “entirely man-made” as “starvation is used as a weapon of war.”

Israeli forces meanwhile launched another raid on the Gaza Strip’s largest hospital early Monday, saying Hamas militants had regrouped there and had fired on them from inside the compound, where Palestinian officials say tens of thousands of people have been sheltering.

The military said it killed a Hamas commander who was armed and hiding inside the medical center, and that one of its own soldiers was killed in the operation.

The army last raided Shifa Hospital in November after claiming that Hamas maintained an elaborate command center within and beneath the facility. The military revealed a tunnel leading to some underground rooms, as well as weapons it said were found inside the hospital. But the evidence fell short of the earlier claims, and critics accused the army of recklessly endangering the lives of civilians.
Rafah offensive could push half of Gaza to starvation

The World Food Program on Monday released the latest findings of its Integrated Food Security Phase Classification, or IPC, an international process for estimating the scale of hunger crises.

It says virtually everyone in Gaza is struggling to get enough food, and that around 677,000 people — nearly a third of the population of 2.3 million — are experiencing the highest level of catastrophic hunger. That includes around 210,000 people in the north.

It warned that if Israel broadens its offensive to the packed southern city of Rafah, as Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has repeatedly vowed, the fighting could drive over a million people — half of Gaza’s population — into catastrophic hunger.

“This is the largest number of people facing imminent famine in the world today, and it has only taken five months to occur,” said Matthew Hollingworth, the acting World Food Program country director for the Palestinian territories.

“It’s still possible to turn this around but there has to be a cease-fire and there has to be massive amounts of food aid to flow consistently, and people need to have access to clean water and health care,” he said.

Northern Gaza, including Gaza City, was the first target of the invasion and entire neighborhoods have been obliterated. It is now the epicenter of Gaza’s humanitarian catastrophe, with many residents reduced to eating animal feed. At least 20 people, mostly children, have died from malnutrition and dehydration in the north, the Health Ministry said earlier this month.

Airdrops by the U.S. and other nations continue, while deliveries on a new sea route have begun, but aid groups say it’s essential that Israel open up more land routes and ease restrictions. The WFP report said airdrops account for a “negligible share” of aid compared with what is brought in on trucks.

Israeli authorities say they place no limits on the entry of aid and accuse U.N. bodies of failing to distribute it in a timely manner. Aid groups say distribution is impossible in much of Gaza because of ongoing hostilities, the difficulty of coordinating with the military and the breakdown of law and order.

Alex de Waal, the executive director of the World Peace Foundation at Tufts University and an expert on global famines, said Israel has had “ample warning” that if it continued to launch massive operations that destroy key infrastructure, displace large numbers of people and obstruct aid operations, the results would be catastrophic.

“In failing to change course, it is culpable for these deaths,” he said.

Ahead of the report’s release, EU foreign policy chief Josep Borrell said it was up to Israel to facilitate more aid.

“Israel has to do it. It is not a question of logistics. It is not because the United Nations has not provided enough support,” he said. “Trucks are stopped. People are dying, while the land crossings are artificially closed.”
‘We’re trapped inside’

The heavy fighting around Shifa Hospital, in the heart of Gaza City, meanwhile pointed to the continuing presence of Palestinian militants in northern Gaza despite the harsh conditions there.

People sheltering in the hospital said Israeli forces backed by tanks and artillery had surrounded the medical complex and that snipers were shooting at people inside. They said the army raided a number of buildings and detained dozens of people.

“We’re trapped inside,” said Abdel-Hady Sayed, who has been sheltering in the medical facility for over three months. “They fire at anything moving. … Doctors and ambulances can’t move.”

Gaza’s Health Ministry said around 30,000 people are sheltering at the hospital, including patients, medical staff and people who have fled their homes seeking safety. The war has displaced around 80% of Gaza’s population.

Rear Adm. Daniel Hagari, the chief Israeli military spokesperson, said the army launched a “high-precision operation” in parts of the medical complex. He said senior Hamas militants had regrouped there and were directing attacks from inside.

The army later said it had killed Faiq Mabhouh, identifying him as a senior member of Hamas’ internal security apparatus. It said Mabhouh was armed and hiding inside the compound, and that “numerous” weapons were found in an adjacent room. The military said its forces detained around 80 people.

Hagari said the patients and medical staff could remain in the medical complex and that a safe passage was available for civilians who wanted to leave.

Israel accuses Hamas of using hospitals and other civilian facilities to shield its fighters, and the Israeli military has raided several hospitals since the start of the war, which was triggered by Hamas’ Oct. 7 attack into southern Israel.

The Gaza Health Ministry said Monday that at least 31,726 Palestinians have been killed in the war, including 81 in the past 24 hours. The ministry doesn’t differentiate between civilians and combatants in its count, but says women and children make up two-thirds of the dead.

Palestinian militants killed some 1,200 people in the surprise attack out of Gaza that triggered the war, and took another 250 people hostage. Hamas is still believed to be holding about 100 captives, as well as the remains of 30 others, after most of the rest were freed during a cease-fire last year in exchange for the release of Palestinians imprisoned by Israel.

The United States, Qatar and Egypt have spent weeks trying to broker another cease-fire and hostage release, but the gulf between the two sides remains wide, with Hamas demanding guarantees for an end to the war and Israel vowing to continue the offensive until it destroys the militant group.

https://www.pbs.org/newshour/world/...w0swoz4-LcWmn-3D4pPo6WoLHiTkS2fPCB0iobE8
Posted By: dawglover05 Re: Israel at war again. - 03/19/24 12:22 AM
That really sucks, man. You hate to see innocents getting caught up, especially when it comes to something as horrible as starvation.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 03/19/24 01:35 PM
When you have one side in control of the border and the flow of humanitarian aid refusing to allow enough food and medical supplies in to avoid famine and starvation of the civilian population, I consider the innocents as being targeted by it and not simply caught up in it.
Posted By: dawglover05 Re: Israel at war again. - 03/19/24 01:44 PM
That's fair. My point was just that I hate seeing things like this happen to innocent people.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 03/19/24 01:50 PM
I do too. And their geographic location doesn't matter to me. The actions of their government doesn't matter to me. But for some reason, time and time again people conflate these things as all being the same. It's the craziness we see now. They try to claim that if you do not support the actions of Netanyahu you must hate Israel, not support the Jewish people or be antisemitic. And nothing could be further from the truth.
Posted By: Day of the Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 03/19/24 07:58 PM
You two should just wear the red pens that the movie stars were wearing to the Oscars that stand for dead Israeli soldiers. You are showing support for terrorist organizations over a US ally and Sovreign nation defending itself.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 03/19/24 08:57 PM
Originally Posted by Day of the Dawg
You two should just wear the red pens that the movie stars were wearing to the Oscars that stand for dead Israeli soldiers. You are showing support for terrorist organizations over a US ally and Sovreign nation defending itself.

Defending yourself does not include starving the civilians of Gaza and deny them medical supplies which in many cases aid those you have injured in the war. Defending yourself does not include choosing to use 2000lb. dumb bombs that kill everyone withing 1000 feet in all directions which has mainly been civilians.

I have always supported Israel defending itself. I have always supported the Israeli people. I have always supported that Israel wipe out Hamas. What I don't do is give Netanyahu a free pass on everything he does. Just remember the next time you don't support a decision Biden makes that you are not supporting America. Just remember the rules you yourself are setting for how this all works.
Posted By: dawglover05 Re: Israel at war again. - 03/20/24 12:41 AM
My words: "I hate seeing things like this happen to innocent people."

Day: "You two should just wear the red pens that the movie stars were wearing to the Oscars that stand for dead Israeli soldiers."

Can't make this stuff up...

You are far gone, my friend.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 03/20/24 02:13 PM
Originally Posted by Day of the Dawg
You two should just wear the red pens that the movie stars were wearing to the Oscars that stand for dead Israeli soldiers. You are showing support for terrorist organizations over a US ally and Sovreign nation defending itself.

Or we could just listen to Donnie’s son in law and move everyone out of Gaza, then go in and clean it up.
notallthere
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 03/21/24 05:56 PM
Gaza food aid from Cyprus reaches starving people in north of enclave, says charity

A US-based charity has confirmed that a consignment of almost 200 tons of food aid has reached starving people in northern Gaza today, a week after being despatched by sea from Cyprus.

World Central Kitchen (WCK), working with the UAE and Spanish charity Open Arms, sent the food via the 200-mile (322-km) sea route from Larnaca to a makeshift jetty off Gaza. The consignment arrived on Friday. A convoy of eight trucks belonging to the World Food Programme (WFP) then ferried the aid — the equivalent of half a million meals — to its final destination today.

A UN-backed report said on Monday that famine was “imminent” in the northern Gaza Strip, where some 300,000 people are trapped by fighting. Across the whole Gaza Strip, the number of people facing “catastrophic hunger” has risen to 1.1 million, half the population.

A second vessel is now moored at Larnaca with 240 tons of food on board, waiting to travel pending weather conditions, noted WCK and Cypriot government officials. “WCK is ready to send tonnes of food weekly to Gaza with support from the international community,” said the charity.

Aid agencies say the food that can be delivered by sea to Gaza, though welcome, is completely inadequate for the scale of people’s needs and they have urged Israel to allow far more aid in by road. Hundreds of aid trucks are lined up at the Gaza border awaiting permission to enter.

Cyprus, which backed the WCK initiative, aims to coordinate more aid to the besieged Palestinian enclave. It will host officials from a number of countries on 21 March for talks on the issue, government spokesperson Konstantinos Letymbiotis told journalists. “There will be an exchange of views on what material support states could offer. The extent of humanitarian assistance non-combatants have in Gaza requires the support of many countries.”

https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/2...people-in-north-of-enclave-says-charity/

It seems as though the war strategy of starving the population of Gaza and denying them medical supplies may be averted. But there's still a lot of work to be done.
Posted By: Day of the Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 03/21/24 07:03 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Gaza food aid from Cyprus reaches starving people in north of enclave, says charity

A US-based charity has confirmed that a consignment of almost 200 tons of food aid has reached starving people in northern Gaza today, a week after being despatched by sea from Cyprus.

World Central Kitchen (WCK), working with the UAE and Spanish charity Open Arms, sent the food via the 200-mile (322-km) sea route from Larnaca to a makeshift jetty off Gaza. The consignment arrived on Friday. A convoy of eight trucks belonging to the World Food Programme (WFP) then ferried the aid — the equivalent of half a million meals — to its final destination today.

A UN-backed report said on Monday that famine was “imminent” in the northern Gaza Strip, where some 300,000 people are trapped by fighting. Across the whole Gaza Strip, the number of people facing “catastrophic hunger” has risen to 1.1 million, half the population.

A second vessel is now moored at Larnaca with 240 tons of food on board, waiting to travel pending weather conditions, noted WCK and Cypriot government officials. “WCK is ready to send tonnes of food weekly to Gaza with support from the international community,” said the charity.

Aid agencies say the food that can be delivered by sea to Gaza, though welcome, is completely inadequate for the scale of people’s needs and they have urged Israel to allow far more aid in by road. Hundreds of aid trucks are lined up at the Gaza border awaiting permission to enter.

Cyprus, which backed the WCK initiative, aims to coordinate more aid to the besieged Palestinian enclave. It will host officials from a number of countries on 21 March for talks on the issue, government spokesperson Konstantinos Letymbiotis told journalists. “There will be an exchange of views on what material support states could offer. The extent of humanitarian assistance non-combatants have in Gaza requires the support of many countries.”

https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/2...people-in-north-of-enclave-says-charity/

It seems as though the war strategy of starving the population of Gaza and denying them medical supplies may be averted. But there's still a lot of work to be done.

You do realize if they give up their hostages this would all be averted!!!
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 03/21/24 07:13 PM
So that's your excuse for starving millions of innocent women and children? You feel that a strategy of starving the civilians of Gaza to fight Hamas is okay? You see, while I'm all for Hamas being defeated and Israel accomplishing that mission, that doesn't excuse them starving and denying medical supplies to the citizens of Gaza. Those are two very different things. Some seem to think making innocent people victims of war on purpose by starving them and denying them medical supplies is perfectly acceptable behavior. It's not. When you become the very thing you claim makes you enemy so terrible, how does that make you any better than your enemy? Netanyahu is doing so much damage to the nation of Israel on the global stage that they're losing support from many nations they have depended on. What he is doing borders on criminal and maybe even goes further than that.
Posted By: Day of the Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 03/22/24 11:13 AM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
So that's your excuse for starving millions of innocent women and children? You feel that a strategy of starving the civilians of Gaza to fight Hamas is okay? You see, while I'm all for Hamas being defeated and Israel accomplishing that mission, that doesn't excuse them starving and denying medical supplies to the citizens of Gaza. Those are two very different things. Some seem to think making innocent people victims of war on purpose by starving them and denying them medical supplies is perfectly acceptable behavior. It's not. When you become the very thing you claim makes you enemy so terrible, how does that make you any better than your enemy? Netanyahu is doing so much damage to the nation of Israel on the global stage that they're losing support from many nations they have depended on. What he is doing borders on criminal and maybe even goes further than that.

I don't see it. But my judgement is not based on an antisemitic UN either.
Posted By: Bull_Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 03/22/24 12:56 PM
Originally Posted by Day of the Dawg
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Gaza food aid from Cyprus reaches starving people in north of enclave, says charity

A US-based charity has confirmed that a consignment of almost 200 tons of food aid has reached starving people in northern Gaza today, a week after being despatched by sea from Cyprus.

World Central Kitchen (WCK), working with the UAE and Spanish charity Open Arms, sent the food via the 200-mile (322-km) sea route from Larnaca to a makeshift jetty off Gaza. The consignment arrived on Friday. A convoy of eight trucks belonging to the World Food Programme (WFP) then ferried the aid — the equivalent of half a million meals — to its final destination today.

A UN-backed report said on Monday that famine was “imminent” in the northern Gaza Strip, where some 300,000 people are trapped by fighting. Across the whole Gaza Strip, the number of people facing “catastrophic hunger” has risen to 1.1 million, half the population.

A second vessel is now moored at Larnaca with 240 tons of food on board, waiting to travel pending weather conditions, noted WCK and Cypriot government officials. “WCK is ready to send tonnes of food weekly to Gaza with support from the international community,” said the charity.

Aid agencies say the food that can be delivered by sea to Gaza, though welcome, is completely inadequate for the scale of people’s needs and they have urged Israel to allow far more aid in by road. Hundreds of aid trucks are lined up at the Gaza border awaiting permission to enter.

Cyprus, which backed the WCK initiative, aims to coordinate more aid to the besieged Palestinian enclave. It will host officials from a number of countries on 21 March for talks on the issue, government spokesperson Konstantinos Letymbiotis told journalists. “There will be an exchange of views on what material support states could offer. The extent of humanitarian assistance non-combatants have in Gaza requires the support of many countries.”

https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/2...people-in-north-of-enclave-says-charity/

It seems as though the war strategy of starving the population of Gaza and denying them medical supplies may be averted. But there's still a lot of work to be done.

You do realize if they give up their hostages this would all be averted!!!

Yes, holding innocents hostage so the "bad guys" will let go of innocent hostages makes all sorts of sense. rolleyes Personally, I think it just makes "Israel" "bad guys." Palestinians use the same logic. In their eyes, they took hostages so that Israel would stop holding their country hostage.

Beating "evil" by behaving evil never seems to work out for some reason. It seems to just lead to more evil.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 03/22/24 04:03 PM
Originally Posted by Day of the Dawg
I don't see it. But my judgement is not based on an antisemitic UN either.

Nor is mine. My judgement is based on the fact Israel is starving and denying millions of innocent civilians including women, children and the elderly of medical supplies. Something my Chirstian beliefs will never make excuses for. They are not Hamas.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 03/22/24 04:17 PM
https://wck.org/

I’ve volunteered with this organization on many occasions. They do great work, and save lives.

Lots of info on GAZA and what they are doing.

I must disagree with you. “They are not HAMAS” statement. Not all, but many of them are children and wives of HAMAS fighters. Palestinians make up the major part of HAMAS fighting force. That’s not an excuse to kill and starve everyone, it’s just a fact.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 03/22/24 04:24 PM
I don't usually talk about my donations to charities. I don't donate for the recognition. But in this case I will say I'm a big supporter of Chef José Andrés and WCK along with one of the larger food banks in my area. I wish I could do much more than I am able to do, but food is the essential need to support life. And while I'm sure my wish will never be met, I hope for a time when everyone on the planet has enough to eat.

They already have a ship with tons of food being delivered in Gaza. God bless Chef José Andrés and the work he is doing around the globe to feed the hungry.
Posted By: Day of the Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 03/22/24 04:39 PM
Originally Posted by Bull_Dawg
Originally Posted by Day of the Dawg
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Gaza food aid from Cyprus reaches starving people in north of enclave, says charity

A US-based charity has confirmed that a consignment of almost 200 tons of food aid has reached starving people in northern Gaza today, a week after being despatched by sea from Cyprus.

World Central Kitchen (WCK), working with the UAE and Spanish charity Open Arms, sent the food via the 200-mile (322-km) sea route from Larnaca to a makeshift jetty off Gaza. The consignment arrived on Friday. A convoy of eight trucks belonging to the World Food Programme (WFP) then ferried the aid — the equivalent of half a million meals — to its final destination today.

A UN-backed report said on Monday that famine was “imminent” in the northern Gaza Strip, where some 300,000 people are trapped by fighting. Across the whole Gaza Strip, the number of people facing “catastrophic hunger” has risen to 1.1 million, half the population.

A second vessel is now moored at Larnaca with 240 tons of food on board, waiting to travel pending weather conditions, noted WCK and Cypriot government officials. “WCK is ready to send tonnes of food weekly to Gaza with support from the international community,” said the charity.

Aid agencies say the food that can be delivered by sea to Gaza, though welcome, is completely inadequate for the scale of people’s needs and they have urged Israel to allow far more aid in by road. Hundreds of aid trucks are lined up at the Gaza border awaiting permission to enter.

Cyprus, which backed the WCK initiative, aims to coordinate more aid to the besieged Palestinian enclave. It will host officials from a number of countries on 21 March for talks on the issue, government spokesperson Konstantinos Letymbiotis told journalists. “There will be an exchange of views on what material support states could offer. The extent of humanitarian assistance non-combatants have in Gaza requires the support of many countries.”

https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/2...people-in-north-of-enclave-says-charity/

It seems as though the war strategy of starving the population of Gaza and denying them medical supplies may be averted. But there's still a lot of work to be done.

You do realize if they give up their hostages this would all be averted!!!

Yes, holding innocents hostage so the "bad guys" will let go of innocent hostages makes all sorts of sense. rolleyes Personally, I think it just makes "Israel" "bad guys." Palestinians use the same logic. In their eyes, they took hostages so that Israel would stop holding their country hostage.

Beating "evil" by behaving evil never seems to work out for some reason. It seems to just lead to more evil.

Except Palestine is not a Country. It is actually part of Israel. This confirms the two-state solution does not work and when this conflict ends Israel should take back control over Gaza.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 03/22/24 04:44 PM
A two state solution has never been accomplished or established, so you nor anyone on the planet can say it didn’t or doesn’t work.
Posted By: Bull_Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 03/22/24 05:23 PM
Originally Posted by Day of the Dawg
Originally Posted by Bull_Dawg
Originally Posted by Day of the Dawg
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Gaza food aid from Cyprus reaches starving people in north of enclave, says charity

A US-based charity has confirmed that a consignment of almost 200 tons of food aid has reached starving people in northern Gaza today, a week after being despatched by sea from Cyprus.

World Central Kitchen (WCK), working with the UAE and Spanish charity Open Arms, sent the food via the 200-mile (322-km) sea route from Larnaca to a makeshift jetty off Gaza. The consignment arrived on Friday. A convoy of eight trucks belonging to the World Food Programme (WFP) then ferried the aid — the equivalent of half a million meals — to its final destination today.

A UN-backed report said on Monday that famine was “imminent” in the northern Gaza Strip, where some 300,000 people are trapped by fighting. Across the whole Gaza Strip, the number of people facing “catastrophic hunger” has risen to 1.1 million, half the population.

A second vessel is now moored at Larnaca with 240 tons of food on board, waiting to travel pending weather conditions, noted WCK and Cypriot government officials. “WCK is ready to send tonnes of food weekly to Gaza with support from the international community,” said the charity.

Aid agencies say the food that can be delivered by sea to Gaza, though welcome, is completely inadequate for the scale of people’s needs and they have urged Israel to allow far more aid in by road. Hundreds of aid trucks are lined up at the Gaza border awaiting permission to enter.

Cyprus, which backed the WCK initiative, aims to coordinate more aid to the besieged Palestinian enclave. It will host officials from a number of countries on 21 March for talks on the issue, government spokesperson Konstantinos Letymbiotis told journalists. “There will be an exchange of views on what material support states could offer. The extent of humanitarian assistance non-combatants have in Gaza requires the support of many countries.”

https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/2...people-in-north-of-enclave-says-charity/

It seems as though the war strategy of starving the population of Gaza and denying them medical supplies may be averted. But there's still a lot of work to be done.

You do realize if they give up their hostages this would all be averted!!!

Yes, holding innocents hostage so the "bad guys" will let go of innocent hostages makes all sorts of sense. rolleyes Personally, I think it just makes "Israel" "bad guys." Palestinians use the same logic. In their eyes, they took hostages so that Israel would stop holding their country hostage.

Beating "evil" by behaving evil never seems to work out for some reason. It seems to just lead to more evil.

Except Palestine is not a Country. It is actually part of Israel. This confirms the two-state solution does not work and when this conflict ends Israel should take back control over Gaza.

Someone saying," huminah, huminah Palestine is now Israel," makes it so? So, if Putin decides to say Ohio is now Russia that makes it so? Draw up some paperwork, get some signatures. As long as outsiders are willing to say it is kosher, that's fine?
Posted By: dawglover05 Re: Israel at war again. - 03/22/24 07:52 PM
With recent political rhetoric from one of our Senators, combined with numerous ads for politicians running for the other Senate seat, I sometimes think Ohio IS part of Russia.
Posted By: Bull_Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 03/22/24 08:01 PM
Originally Posted by dawglover05
With recent political rhetoric from one of our Senators, combined with numerous ads for politicians running for the other Senate seat, I sometimes think Ohio IS part of Russia.

Uh-oh. I figured it out. After Russia and Ukraine come to the table for peace talks, Biden is going to offer up Ohio as the new Ukrainian homeland. None of the other states would object. It's always been Ohio against the world.

...I started out kidding... Thinking about it...Hmmmmmmm....

Nope, still mostly joking.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 03/30/24 05:45 PM
Second shipment with more than 300 tons of food for Gaza leaves Cyprus port

LARNACA, Cyprus, March 30 (Reuters) - Ships carrying 332 tons of food for Gaza left Cyprus's Larnaca port on Saturday in a convoy which will reach the besieged enclave early next week, authorities said.

It is the second shipment this month after Israel eased a 17-year naval blockade on the Gaza Strip to allow aid in from Cyprus, sourced by U.S. charity World Central Kitchen (WCK) for starving Palestinians.

The aid will be taken to Gaza on a cargo ship and a barge towed by a salvage vessel, along with a tugboat carrying a support team in a journey which will take about 60 hours, a Cypriot official told Reuters.

Cypriot authorities have established, in cooperation with Israel, a maritime corridor to facilitate pre-screened cargoes arriving directly in Gaza.

WCK, which has been active in Gaza for months, arranged the mission with Spain's Open Arms charity, with financing mainly from the UAE and support from Cypriot authorities.

On its first mission earlier in March, it built a makeshift jetty from rubble to offload almost 200 tons of food in the enclave, which does not have any port facilities. Saturday's convoy includes two forklifts and a crane to assist with future marine deliveries, as well as a team to operate the crane.

Separately, the United States plans to construct a floating pier off Gaza to receive aid. The target for completion is May 1, but it could be ready by around April 15, Cypriot President Nikos Christodoulides said late on Friday, citing briefings with U.S. officials earlier in the week.

The United Nations has warned that famine is imminent in the northern Gaza Strip, where 300,000 people are trapped by fighting. More than half of Gaza's population of 2.3 million could face famine by July.

Aid agencies say food delivered by sea to Gaza, though welcome, cannot meet people's needs and they have urged Israel to allow more aid to arrive by land.

U.N. officials have accused Israel of blocking humanitarian supplies to Gaza. Israeli officials reject those accusations and say the delivery of aid once inside the territory is the responsibility of U.N. and humanitarian agencies.

https://www.reuters.com/world/middl...food-gaza-leaves-cyprus-port-2024-03-30/
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 04/01/24 05:38 PM
Are these the same UN officials blaming Israel blocking aid that were involved in the Oct. attack in Isreal?

At least 12 employees of the U.N. agency for Palestinian refugees participated in or aided the Oct. 7 terrorist attack on Israel, according to Israeli intelligence dossiers obtained by NBC News, which accuse the workers of actions ranging from kidnapping Israelis to supplying logistical support.

The 12 include seven teachers, two school administrators and a social worker employed by the United Nations Relief and Works Agency, or UNRWA, which provides education, food and health care to a large percentage of the roughly 2 million people living in Gaza.

A counselor at an UNRWA school is alleged to have taken part in the kidnapping of a female hostage on Oct. 7. An elementary school teacher is accused of having participated in the attack on Re’im, where dozens of Israelis were killed and hostages were taken. Another teacher is alleged to have equipped himself with anti-tank weapons the night before the attack.

A math teacher alleged to be a Hamas operative is accused of having photographed a woman who was kidnapped, and another math teacher from a different Hamas battalion is accused of having crossed into Israeli territory on the day of the attack.

The information compiled in the two dossiers was shared with U.S. officials Wednesday, prompting the U.S. to suspend financial support to the organization. In the ensuing days, eight other countries, including the U.K., Germany and Finland, followed suit.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/01/24 05:45 PM
WTH are you talking about? Israel just left a hospital they claimed took 14 days to clear. Is it your claim Israel isn't blocking aid from entering Gaza? That they don't control the border crossings? That as such only a fraction of the aid needed is being allowed in?
Posted By: mgh888 Re: Israel at war again. - 04/01/24 05:53 PM
Its odd no one is talking about the thousands of Israelis marching against Benjamin Netanyahu and wanting an election .... Guessing they might get labeled antisemitic by some right because to question Benjamin Netanyahu and his acts committing war crimes must be antisemitic.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 04/01/24 05:55 PM
Just saying In a world of disinformation, it’s plausible. I’m having a hard time believing everything U.N. officials report inside of GAZA . Especially when many were involved in the attack.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 04/01/24 05:58 PM
Originally Posted by mgh888
Its odd no one is talking about the thousands of Israelis marching against Benjamin Netanyahu and wanting an election .... Guessing they might get labeled antisemitic by some right because to question Benjamin Netanyahu and his acts committing war crimes must be antisemitic.

I know right? It’s odd to me as well. He needs to be voted out I agree.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/01/24 06:06 PM
You do realize it's not only the U.N. that's saying these things, correct? And it seems one who you are refusing to believe at the U.N is the European Union's foreign policy chief. So yeah, I'm pretty sure he wasn't involved "in the Oct. attack in Isreal".

Human Rights Watch says Israel is violating order from top U.N. court by blocking aid to Gazans

https://www.pbs.org/newshour/world/...-top-u-n-court-by-blocking-aid-to-gazans

Refugees International says Israel has attacked aid convoys, enforced capricious bans against medicines and water filters, and turned back desperately needed assistance

https://forward.com/fast-forward/58...report-israel-blocking-humanitarian-aid/

I have shown you time and time again how many organizations have confirmed that aid is being restricted by Israel but none of it seems to matter to you.
Posted By: northlima dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/01/24 07:15 PM
Iranian consulate in Damascus flattened in suspected Israeli air strike-Top Iranian general killed. Several Iranian diplomats killed.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/ar-BB1kTfmd
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 04/02/24 01:41 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
You do realize it's not only the U.N. that's saying these things, correct? And it seems one who you are refusing to believe at the U.N is the European Union's foreign policy chief. So yeah, I'm pretty sure he wasn't involved "in the Oct. attack in Isreal".

Human Rights Watch says Israel is violating order from top U.N. court by blocking aid to Gazans

https://www.pbs.org/newshour/world/...-top-u-n-court-by-blocking-aid-to-gazans

Refugees International says Israel has attacked aid convoys, enforced capricious bans against medicines and water filters, and turned back desperately needed assistance

https://forward.com/fast-forward/58...report-israel-blocking-humanitarian-aid/

I have shown you time and time again how many organizations have confirmed that aid is being restricted by Israel but none of it seems to matter to you.

I replied to your post that stated “U.N. officials have accused Israel of blocking humanitarian supplies to Gaza. Israeli officials reject those accusations and say the delivery of aid once inside the territory is the responsibility of U.N. and humanitarian agencies.” It’s hard for me to believe the UN officials in Gaza because of their involvement in the OCT attacks. Anyways Hamas has rejected all calls for ceasefire. And as I noted would happen WCK is a bullseye for attacks as 7 volunteers were killed yesterday delivering aid.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/02/24 02:22 PM
Originally Posted by PerfectSpiral
Anyways Hamas has rejected all calls for ceasefire. And as I noted would happen WCK is a bullseye for attacks as 7 volunteers were killed yesterday delivering aid.

The civilians of Gaza are not Hamas. I'm advocating that the innocent civilians of Gaza not be starved to death and denied medical supplies. Those are two different things.

You did say that WCK would have a bullseye on their backs. You were just wrong about who would have the bullseye on them. It wasn't Hamas. It was Israel.......

Celebrity Chef Jose Andrés Blasts Israel Over Slain Gaza Colleagues

The Spanish-American chef called on the Israeli government to “stop killing civilians and aid workers” after the death of several workers at his nonprofit in Gaza.

Celebrity chef José Andrés has released a statement demanding the Israeli government put an end to what he described as “indiscriminate killing” in Gaza after the death of four humanitarian workers at his non-profit, World Central Kitchen.

In a post to X, Andrés said he was “heartbroken and grieving” to learn about the tragic loss of several colleagues, who were killed in an Israeli airstrike on Monday while working to deliver food in the enclave, according to the aid organization.

“These are people…angels…I served alongside in Ukraine, Gaza, Turkey, Morocco, Bahamas, Indonesia. They are not faceless…they are not nameless,” Andrés said in his post. “The Israeli government needs to stop this indiscriminate killing.”

The Israeli Defense Forces have since released a statement promising to conduct “a thorough review at the highest levels” into the incident, adding that “the IDF makes extensive efforts to enable the safe delivery of humanitarian aid.”

Founded by Andrés in 2010, the World Central Kitchen has been at the forefront of operations to deliver food to Gaza’s starving population, which has been living under the threat of famine after months of restrictions to aid deliveries.

In his statement on Monday, Andrés accused Israel of “using food as a weapon” of war in Gaza, and called on the government “to stop restricting humanitarian aid, stop killing civilians and aid workers.” “No more innocent lives lost. Peace starts with our shared humanity. It needs to start now,” he added.

Harrowing footage circulated in the aftermath of the tragedy showed the bodies of several World Central Kitchen employees, at least three of whom are aid workers reportedly from Australia, Poland, and the U.K. Their identities have not yet been made public.

The World Central Kitchen has operated in conflict zones and natural disasters around the world, with a focus on facilitating food deliveries in times of crises. In recent weeks, the aid organization has reportedly delivered hundreds of tons worth of food to the war-torn Gaza Strip, where it operates dozens of kitchens.

In a statement confirming the incident on Monday, the nonprofit called the killings a “tragedy,” adding in an X post that “humanitarian aid workers and civilians should NEVER be a target. EVER.”

https://www.thedailybeast.com/celebrity-chef-jose-andres-blasts-israel-over-slain-gaza-aid-workers
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 04/02/24 02:42 PM
I’ve worked with Chef Andres volunteering myself and believe in his word. I find it hard to believe IDF forces are responsible in this case. I could be wrong. We’ll see.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/02/24 02:51 PM
If anyone would know I believe it would be him. Unless of course you believe he's just got all of his information wrong from his own people on the ground in Gaza. It's not "We'll see" for anyone being objective. It's "We see". It seems as though no matter who reports these things over and over again you always believe Israel hasn't done anything wrong. There are no excuses for purposefully starving the people of Palestine and denying them medical supplies. But then it seems you deny the claims of the World Health Organization and Doctors Without Borders too. Even the people of Israel are starting to rise up against Netanyahu. Maybe you think they're wrong too.

You will most likely have Israel denying responsibility for this. And I'm pretty sure I know who you will believe.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 04/02/24 03:06 PM
I just want to hear the facts before jumping to a conclusion on my own. But thanks for the LIP lash.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/02/24 03:20 PM
So then it appears you believe that Chef Andre was reporting something that he didn't know the facts about? It appears he did. So will you believe him next time?.......

Israeli airstrike kills 7 aid workers in Gaza, Netanyahu says it was 'unintentional'

Seven were working in besieged Gaza for celebrity chef's NGO
Dead included Palestinians and citizens of UK, Australia, Poland
Netanyahu: Strike 'tragic', Israel will do all to prevent recurrence
World Central Kitchen says attack is 'unforgivable'
Israeli military promises independent investigation

April 2 (Reuters) - Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu said on Tuesday an Israeli airstrike that killed seven people working for celebrity chef Jose Andres' World Central Kitchen charity in Gaza was unintended and "tragic", and the military pledged an independent inquiry.

The Israeli military confirmed the deadly strike on a WCK convoy that killed citizens of Australia, Britain and Poland as well as Palestinians and a dual citizen of the United States and Canada. WCK said they were travelling in two armoured cars emblazoned with the charity's logo and another vehicle.

The military expressed "sincere sorrow" and promised an independent investigation into the incident, which drew widespread condemnation and ratcheted up pressure for steps to ease the disastrous humanitarian situation in Gaza.

"Unfortunately in the past day there was a tragic event in which our forces unintentionally harmed non-combatants in the Gaza Strip," Netanyahu said in a video statement.

"This happens in war. We are conducting a thorough inquiry and are in contact with the governments. We will do everything to prevent a recurrence."

Israel has long denied accusations that it is hindering the distribution of urgently needed food aid in Gaza, which it has besieged in a war since October, saying the problem is caused by international aid groups' inability to get it to those in need.

Despite coordinating movements with the Israeli military, the convoy was hit as it was leaving its Deir al-Balah warehouse after unloading more than 100 tons of humanitarian food aid brought to Gaza by sea, WCK said.

"This is not only an attack against WCK, this is an attack on humanitarian organisations showing up in the most dire of situations where food is being used as a weapon of war," said Erin Gore, chief executive of World Central Kitchen.

"This is unforgivable."


U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blinken said Washington had spoken directly to close ally Israel's government and "urged a swift, thorough and impartial investigation to understand exactly what happened". Blinken, speaking to reporters in Paris, added that humanitarian workers must be protected.

"These people are heroes, they run into the fire, not away from it," he said of the seven NGO workers. "We shouldn't have a situation where people who are simply trying to help their fellow human beings are themselves at grave risk."

The Israeli military (IDF) said it was conducting a thorough review at the highest levels to understand the circumstances of what it called a tragic incident, and pledged an investigation by "an independent, professional and expert body".

Israel has been under rising international pressure to alleviate the severe hunger in Gaza, which has been devastated by months of fighting the Palestinian Islamist group Hamas. Much of the densely populated territory has been laid waste and most of its 2.3 million population displaced.

The United Nations and other international groups have accused Israel of hindering aid distribution with bureaucratic obstacles and failing to ensure the security of food convoys, underlined by a disaster on Feb. 29, in which around 100 people were killed as they awaited an aid delivery.

Hamas, Gaza's dominant group, has said the main problem with aid distribution was Israeli targeting of aid workers. After the latest incident, it issued a statement saying the attack aimed to terrorise workers of international humanitarian agencies, deterring them from their missions.

Last week, the World Court ordered Israel to take all necessary and effective action to ensure basic food supplies to the enclave's Palestinian population and halt spreading famine.

In response, Israeli officials accused the United Nations and other international bodies of "failure" over the problems in getting aid to hungry people in Gaza, saying they lack the logistical capacity to perform their jobs.

Andres, who started WCK in 2010 by sending cooks and food to Haiti after an earthquake, said he was heartbroken and grieving for the families and friends of those who died in the airstrike."The Israeli government needs to stop this indiscriminate killing. It needs to stop restricting humanitarian aid, stop killing civilians and aid workers, and stop using food as a weapon."

WCK, which said last month it had served more than 42 million meals in Gaza over 175 days, announced it was pausing its operations in the region immediately and would make decisions soon about the future of its work.


BRITAIN, AUSTRALIA, POLAND CALL FOR INVESTIGATION

Britain, Australia and Poland, countries which have generally been friendly towards Israel, all demanded action to protect aid workers, underlining Netanyahu's increasing diplomatic isolation over the situation in Gaza.

Australian Prime Minister Anthony Albanese confirmed the death of 44-year-old aid worker Lalzawmi "Zomi" Frankcom and said his government had contacted Israel to demand those responsible be held accountable.

Poland, which also lost a citizen, objected to the "disregard for international humanitarian law and the protection of civilians, including humanitarian workers."

Video obtained by Reuters showed a large hole in the roof of a four-wheel-drive WCK vehicle and its burned and torn interior, as well as paramedics moving bodies into a hospital and displaying the passports of three of those killed.

Conditions in Gaza remain extremely precarious with fighting going on in several areas on Tuesday and 71 people killed in Israeli strikes over the past 24 hours, according to Gaza health authorities.

https://www.reuters.com/world/middl...-hamas-run-media-office-says-2024-04-01/

I guess Israels tactic of terrorizing aid workers succeeded. They managed to run off WCK. Israels explanation? $#!+ happens.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 04/02/24 03:33 PM
Ok I just heard it is reportedly an Israeli air strike. Chef was right. Bengi has some explaining. War crimes tribunals are hell.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/04/24 04:54 PM
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 04/04/24 07:05 PM
I don’t think Biden’s phone call has changed BN mind. Pretty sure he needs to be elected out of power. Aid workers being directly targeted is unacceptable and a war crime.

On the flip side it’s great news for terrorists wanting to kill Israeli’s
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/04/24 07:13 PM
I agree with you. I don't know that they were specifically targeted but there are certainly strong indications they were. The entire delivery that day had been coordinated with the Israeli military before hand including the timing of the delivery and the route they were going to use. Their vehicles were clearly marked. When you combine that with how many aid workers have been killed in Gaza over the past six months alone it would be safe to say that I'm certainly suspicious that Chef Andre is right.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 04/04/24 07:28 PM
I really believed this would turn out to be an attack by Hamas. Boy was I wrong. I just don’t get what BN thinks he’s going to gain out waging war like this. When you become what your enemies are, you have fallen into the abyss, deep into the abyss.
Posted By: dawglover05 Re: Israel at war again. - 04/04/24 07:36 PM
I actually got to meet Chef Andres once in Barcelona. He was among the nicest people I have ever met in my life. The guy is a very loving dad and very philanthropic. This is an effing nightmare what happened.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/04/24 07:38 PM
As it's turning out it is appearing more as though my first thoughts may have tragically been correct. He is using starvation of the Palestinian people as a weapon of war. That's something only the most heinous
and depraved individuals would ever contemplate doing.
Posted By: Day of the Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/04/24 07:42 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
As it's turning out it is appearing more as though my first thoughts may have tragically been correct. He is using starvation of the Palestinian people as a weapon of war. That's something only the most heinous
and depraved individuals would ever contemplate doing.

More antisemitic lies!!! Netanyahu should tell Biden to shut up and stay out of Israel's war on terror. Biden and everyone that supports Hamas is just ignoring what happened on October 7th and ignoring the fact that over 100 Israeli citizens are still being held captive.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/04/24 07:57 PM
You still have yourself convinced that if you don't support Netanyahu you must be antisemitic. You may wish to tell that to the thousands upon thousands of Israeli's protesting for his removal from power in the streets of Israel that. Or are all of those Jewish people antisemitic too? rofl



I guess there's a lot of Israeli's who didn't get your message.
Posted By: northlima dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/04/24 08:23 PM
This can't be good

The CIA has warned Israel that Iran will attack the country in the next 48 hours, it has been reported.
https://www.the-express.com/news/world-news/133437/cia-warning-iran-attack-israel-consulate


KNIFE EDGE Israel’s war cabinet meets over threat of ‘imminent’ attack by Iran amid fears Middle East crisis could spiral into WW3
https://www.the-sun.com/news/10997611/israel-war-cabinet-threat-attack-iran/


Israel urgently evacuates embassies as diplomats fear Iranian revenge strikes
https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/1885038/israel-embassies-red-alert-iran-strike
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/04/24 08:31 PM
This was pretty much assured to happen when Israel bombed Iran's consulate in Syria. I was hoping that Iran would consider the long range consequences and this wouldn't happen. But I believe they feel the need to strike back. Iran will be a much tougher animal for Israel to tackle than Hamas. They have the arms and means to fight back in kind.

Israeli strike on Iran’s consulate in Syria killed 2 generals and 5 other officers, Iran says

https://apnews.com/article/israel-syria-airstrike-iranian-embassy-edca34c52d38c8bc57281e4ebf33b240
Posted By: Day of the Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/05/24 10:53 AM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
This was pretty much assured to happen when Israel bombed Iran's consulate in Syria. I was hoping that Iran would consider the long range consequences and this wouldn't happen. But I believe they feel the need to strike back. Iran will be a much tougher animal for Israel to tackle than Hamas. They have the arms and means to fight back in kind.

Israeli strike on Iran’s consulate in Syria killed 2 generals and 5 other officers, Iran says

https://apnews.com/article/israel-syria-airstrike-iranian-embassy-edca34c52d38c8bc57281e4ebf33b240

Hamas and Hezbollah are both terror organizations sponsored by Iran. Iran has been attacking Israel for a long time thru sponsoring terrorist to act. Israel has bombed the Damascus airport runways many times in the past because Iran was bringing supplies to the region used as weapons against Israel.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 04/05/24 01:09 PM
Originally Posted by dawglover05
I actually got to meet Chef Andres once in Barcelona. He was among the nicest people I have ever met in my life. The guy is a very loving dad and very philanthropic. This is an effing nightmare what happened.

Yes he is. And definitely doing heroic work. And he can cook like a boss.
Posted By: Bull_Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/05/24 01:12 PM
Originally Posted by Day of the Dawg
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
This was pretty much assured to happen when Israel bombed Iran's consulate in Syria. I was hoping that Iran would consider the long range consequences and this wouldn't happen. But I believe they feel the need to strike back. Iran will be a much tougher animal for Israel to tackle than Hamas. They have the arms and means to fight back in kind.

Israeli strike on Iran’s consulate in Syria killed 2 generals and 5 other officers, Iran says

https://apnews.com/article/israel-syria-airstrike-iranian-embassy-edca34c52d38c8bc57281e4ebf33b240

Hamas and Hezbollah are both terror organizations sponsored by Iran. Iran has been attacking Israel for a long time thru sponsoring terrorist to act. Israel has bombed the Damascus airport runways many times in the past because Iran was bringing supplies to the region used as weapons against Israel.

To them, Israel is a terrorist state sponsored by us ("the West"). Israel seems to be providing plenty of evidence to support that perspective of late.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 04/05/24 01:21 PM
NFL
Posted By: Day of the Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/05/24 02:18 PM
Originally Posted by Bull_Dawg
Originally Posted by Day of the Dawg
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
This was pretty much assured to happen when Israel bombed Iran's consulate in Syria. I was hoping that Iran would consider the long range consequences and this wouldn't happen. But I believe they feel the need to strike back. Iran will be a much tougher animal for Israel to tackle than Hamas. They have the arms and means to fight back in kind.

Israeli strike on Iran’s consulate in Syria killed 2 generals and 5 other officers, Iran says

https://apnews.com/article/israel-syria-airstrike-iranian-embassy-edca34c52d38c8bc57281e4ebf33b240

Hamas and Hezbollah are both terror organizations sponsored by Iran. Iran has been attacking Israel for a long time thru sponsoring terrorist to act. Israel has bombed the Damascus airport runways many times in the past because Iran was bringing supplies to the region used as weapons against Israel.

To them, Israel is a terrorist state sponsored by us ("the West"). Israel seems to be providing plenty of evidence to support that perspective of late.

I don't believe terror organizations like Hamas and Hezbollah or an axis of evil nation like Iran's point of view really matter. Israel is a Sovereign nation and being a sovereign nation they have a right to defend themselves.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 04/05/24 02:28 PM
Nobody questioned that. It’s the way they do it that could be criminal. Israel should know this more than any other nation on earth.
Posted By: MemphisBrownie Re: Israel at war again. - 04/05/24 02:46 PM
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/05/24 03:25 PM
And starving the civilians on purpose. There's that. But I guess that's considered okay though.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/05/24 03:28 PM
Originally Posted by Day of the Dawg
I don't believe terror organizations like Hamas and Hezbollah or an axis of evil nation like Iran's point of view really matter. Israel is a Sovereign nation and being a sovereign nation they have a right to defend themselves.

Starving Palestinian women and children and denying them medical supplies is not defending yourself.
Posted By: Day of the Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/05/24 03:51 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Originally Posted by Day of the Dawg
I don't believe terror organizations like Hamas and Hezbollah or an axis of evil nation like Iran's point of view really matter. Israel is a Sovereign nation and being a sovereign nation they have a right to defend themselves.

Starving Palestinian women and children and denying them medical supplies is not defending yourself.

I blame Hamas for the starving of the Palestinian civilians. They caused the war. They have stolen money for years purposed for Palestinian civilians and used it for self-gain and military purposes. But go ahead and believe all the anti-Israel propaganda.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/05/24 04:00 PM
Of course you blame them. You think starving women and children that are in no way affiliated with Hamas is a perfectly fine way to get back at Hamas. Since when did fighting a war include starving women and children? I know you hate to admit to the inhumanity Netanyahu is inflicting on these innocent people, I hope calling the truth propaganda makes you feel better about it.

Netanyahu controls the aid that goes into Gaza. He is purposefully restricting it down to a trickle. He is starving those people. You approve. That's disgusting.

That's the facts of what's going on on the ground.
Posted By: FATE Re: Israel at war again. - 04/05/24 04:00 PM
Originally Posted by MemphisBrownie

An unpopular take, but one I definitely agree with.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/05/24 04:04 PM
Israel to open 3 aid corridors following Biden's call with Netanyahu

Washington — The Israeli government has approved the opening of three humanitarian aid corridors that were specifically requested by President Biden in a Thursday call with Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu.

Mr. Biden told Netanyahu the Israeli strike that killed seven aid workers in Gaza was "unacceptable" and warned that U.S. policy toward the conflict going forward will depend on Israel's actions to relieve the ongoing humanitarian crisis, the White House said.

The Erez Crossing in northern Gaza, which has not been open since the start of the conflict, will be opened. The Port of Ashdod will be opened for humanitarian deliveries, and aid trucks from Jordan will be allowed to traverse Israel into Gaza via the Kerem Shalom border crossing.

"This increased aid will prevent a humanitarian crisis and is necessary to ensure the continuation of the fighting and to achieve the goals of the war," Israel's Cabinet said in a statement.

The two leaders spoke for the first time since Monday's deadly strike that killed workers from the World Central Kitchen, a charity that has worked to deliver food aid in Gaza. One American was among the dead. Mr. Biden told Netanyahu "the strikes on humanitarian workers and the overall humanitarian situation are unacceptable," the White House said in a summary of the conversation.

Mr. Biden said on Tuesday that he was "outraged and heartbroken" by the deadly strike, which prompted international condemnation. Israeli officials have said the strike was unintentional and a mistake.

The president "made clear the need for Israel to announce and implement a series of specific, concrete, and measurable steps to address civilian harm, humanitarian suffering, and the safety of aid workers," the White House said. "He made clear that U.S. policy with respect to Gaza will be determined by our assessment of Israel's immediate action on these steps. He underscored that an immediate ceasefire is essential to stabilize and improve the humanitarian situation and protect innocent civilians, and he urged the prime minister to empower his negotiators to conclude a deal without delay to bring the hostages home."

National Security Council spokesman John Kirby wouldn't get into details about what any U.S. policy change might be. "If there's no changes to their policy and their approaches, then there's going to have to be changes to ours," Kirby said at the White House, noting the call lasted about 30 minutes.

The strike on the World Central Kitchen workers has become the latest flashpoint in the U.S.-Israel relationship. The U.S. has significant leverage over Israel as its main supplier of weapons and military equipment.

José Andrés, the head of the World Central Kitchen, said the nonprofit aid organization had been communicating its workers' movements to the Israeli Defense Forces before the strike on Monday. In an interview with Reuters, he accused Israel of "deliberately" targeting the charity workers.

"This was not just a bad luck situation where, 'Oops, we dropped a bomb in the wrong place,'" Andrés told the news agency, insisting his organization's vehicles were clearly marked. Andrés said he believes the vehicles were targeted "systematically, car by car."

Nir Barkat, Israel's economy minister, dismissed Andrés' comments as "nonsense" in an interview with CBS News' partner network BBC News, insisting that it had been a "grave mistake" and for which he said Israel was "terribly sorry."

The U.S. has no plans to conduct an independent investigation into the strike, Kirby told reporters Wednesday. White House press secretary Karine Jean-Pierre said the president wants to see a swift, comprehensive investigation, but will leave that to the Israelis. The Biden administration is "going to continue to have those really tough conversations" with its Israeli counterparts, she said.

"We understand how Chef Andrés is feeling," Jean-Pierre told reporters Wednesday. "He just lost members of his team, I'm sure who felt like family to him as well."

The relationship between Mr. Biden and Netanyahu has becoming increasingly tense, with disagreements spilling out into public view. Netanyahu recently canceled a visit by an Israeli delegation to Washington after the U.S. declined to block a vote in the U.N. Security Council calling for a cease-fire in Gaza and the release of hostages taken by Hamas on Oct. 7.

Last month, Mr. Biden said he believes Netanyahu is "hurting Israel more than helping Israel" by not doing more to avoid civilian deaths in Gaza. In response, Netanyahu said Mr. Biden was "wrong."

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/biden-netanyahu-phone-call-israel-world-central-kitchen-strike-gaza/
Posted By: Day of the Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/05/24 04:21 PM
Netanyahu should follow the teaching in Proverbs 14:7 stay away from the fool; you will not find knowledge on their lips. And Biden is a fool.
Posted By: mgh888 Re: Israel at war again. - 04/05/24 04:27 PM
28 nations and counting.... And still there are those that want to suggest what Israel is doing is just fine... Hard to fathom. I do feel wirh some certainnty that if US cutizens were dying and starving in such a conflict many that are championing the Israeli respinse would be calling for nukes to be used in retaliation.
Posted By: Bull_Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/05/24 04:28 PM
Originally Posted by Day of the Dawg
Netanyahu should follow the teaching in Proverbs 14:7 stay away from the fool; you will not find knowledge on their lips. And Biden is a fool.

If you're going to quote scripture, Romans 12:17-21 feels pretty applicable:

Originally Posted by ESV
Repay no one evil for evil, but give thought to do what is honorable in the sight of all. If possible, so far as it depends on you, live peaceably with all. Beloved, never avenge yourselves, but leave it to the wrath of God, for it is written, “Vengeance is mine, I will repay, says the Lord.” To the contrary, “if your enemy is hungry, feed him; if he is thirsty, give him something to drink; for by so doing you will heap burning coals on his head.” Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/05/24 04:30 PM
It's too bad that he doesn't believe in Jesus or maybe he would have paid attention to this part. Maybe you should too if you plan to use the Bible as your reference.....

Matthew 25:40-45
King James Version

40 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.

41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

42 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink:

43 I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.

44 Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?

45 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.

And before you go off half cocked, just remember God said that he so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son. He didn't say the U.S. or Israel.
Posted By: Day of the Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/05/24 04:46 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
It's too bad that he doesn't believe in Jesus or maybe he would have paid attention to this part. Maybe you should too if you plan to use the Bible as your reference.....

Matthew 25:40-45
King James Version

40 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.

41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

42 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink:

43 I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.

44 Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?

45 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.

And before you go off half cocked, just remember God said that he so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son. He didn't say the U.S. or Israel.


So, you want Israel to take in feed, and drink and clothe the same people that murdered their citizens, raped their women, put their children in ovens, etc.... I could go on and on and on.

You do realize that there is a prophesy in Ezekial 38 and 39 the Gog Magog war where Russia, Iran, Turkey, Syria, and a few northern Africa nations (the same nations the hoopties reside from) come together to attack Israel and Israel has no other nation willing to help them. Wow that seems to be happening with the spread of antisemitism. Also, that sounds like a US with Joe Biden at the reigns. Then God steps in and causes earthquakes and rains fire from the sky down on the invaders so much so that it takes 7 years to bury the dead. The God of Israel never sleeps nor slumbers. May God arise and may his enemies be scattered. Let's just hope we never make ourselves enemies to Israel. God also says he will bless those that bless Israel and curse those that curse Israel.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/05/24 04:51 PM
The women, children and afflicted Palestinians didn't murder anyone. Hamas did. What people aren't willing to support Israel doing is starving those civilians while you are. When jesus arises he won't be starving anyone. You have elective scripture syndrome.

Joe Biden supports you not starve innocent people. Oh the humanity!
Posted By: dawglover05 Re: Israel at war again. - 04/05/24 05:14 PM
So, do the bible verses that you quote only mean something, and not the ones that Bull and Pit quoted? I'm just trying to figure out which parts of the bible matter, for my own edification...or can we pick and choose?
Posted By: dawglover05 Re: Israel at war again. - 04/05/24 05:16 PM
I actually didn't expect anything at all to have come from the Biden call. I imagine it was rather tense and terse. Glad they opened up corridors. Not sure which pressure points were pressed.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/05/24 05:22 PM
I have no idea and hopefully Netanyahu will comply with the requests to the point we will never have to know. The Bible is an odd book to the extent that different people who read it come away with totally different conclusions as we can see.
Posted By: dawglover05 Re: Israel at war again. - 04/05/24 06:17 PM
I find that the "subservient" passage quote never seems to go well when I quote it at home laugh
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/05/24 06:21 PM
Did you ever consider trying this?



naughtydevil
Posted By: dawglover05 Re: Israel at war again. - 04/05/24 06:35 PM
Ha, I prefer sleeping in my own bed.
Posted By: Clemdawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/07/24 02:09 AM
Sincere question:
Do you belong to a "Last Days" Ministry?


[Y/N]
Posted By: northlima dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/07/24 03:09 PM
https://www.jpost.com/breaking-news/article-795724#google_vignette


IDF ends active ground invasion, completely withdraws from southern Gaza
The decision came less than two days after Israel opened the Erez Crossing and Ashdod port to transfer humanitarian aid.
By YONAH JEREMY BOB
APRIL 7, 2024 12:06
Updated: APRIL 7, 2024 15:44
Email Twitter Facebook fb-messenger
Israeli soldiers walk past Israeli tanks near Israel's border with the Gaza Strip, in southern Israel October 15, 2023. (photo credit: REUTERS/AMIR COHEN)
Israeli soldiers walk past Israeli tanks near Israel's border with the Gaza Strip, in southern Israel October 15, 2023.
(photo credit: REUTERS/AMIR COHEN)

The IDF on Sunday announced that it had concluded the active invasion stage of the war for now while leaving open the possibility of a future new invasion of Rafah in deep southern Gaza.

In terms of IDF soldiers, this means that the IDF has withdrawn all of Division 98 from Khan Yunis in southern Gaza while maintaining one plus brigades - the Nahal brigade and portions of Brigade 401 – in northern and central Gaza.

Although a top IDF official said that this change had nothing to do with US pressure, the timing was unmistakable in coming right after the IDF’s disastrous mistaken killing of seven humanitarian aid workers last week.

The decision also came less than two days after Israel opened the Erez Crossing and Ashdod port to transfer humanitarian aid, decisions made under threat by the US of potentially losing weapons support after Jerusalem had refused these requests from Washington for months.

Critically, this means that Palestinians can, on one hand, move freely within southern Gaza and Khan Yunis and that there is a complete vacuum for preventing a return of Hamas governance, but the IDF is keeping northern and central Gaza cut off from the south.


This means Palestinians cannot move from south to north and that over two million Palestinians, more than half of whom are northern Gaza residents, remain separated from their communities, with somewhere between 150,000-300,000 Palestinians remaining in northern Gaza, who never left.

At one point, the IDF had five divisions, between 30,000 and 40,000 ground forces, deep into Gaza, as well as even larger forces circling the Strip.


Those forces were reduced significantly in mid-January when the IDF declared it had achieved operational control of northern Gaza and released Division 63 to return to Fits standard northern border duties facing off against Hezbollah.

But from December until now, Division 98 was destroying Hamas’s forces in and around Khan Yunis, at one point with around seven brigades.

By early February, Division 98 had achieved most of its mission, but it continued more minor operations in areas such as the Hamed neighborhoods of Khan Yunis.

It had been accepted conventional wisdom from top Israeli officials that a major reason for keeping Division 98 in Khan Yunis was to achieve concessions from Hamas in the hostage exchange negotiations.

Hamas immediately declared the IDF withdrawal, even partial, a victory for sticking to its position of demanding IDF withdrawals, including of troops in northern Gaza.

The world’s attention will likely now shift to whether the IDF will invade Rafah first, whether Hamas will cut a deal for the hostages to avoid such an invasion, or whether Israel will concede further to Hamas’s demands for returning more Palestinians to northern Gaza.

An IDF official tried to frame the withdrawal from Khan Yunis as opening up Rafah as a stronger possibility because now hundreds of thousands of Palestinians may return there.

The official said that if more Palestinians leave Rafah, evacuating the remaining civilians will be easier without needing to take active, aggressive measures to move them.


In addition, the IDF said that its operation taking over Shifa Hospital a second time shows that it can quickly penetrate and take down Hamas if it tries to reform military units.

Politicians and Hostage families react to the news
United Right Party leader Gideon Sa’ar commented on the move in a post on X. "Regardless of what happens later in the war, the continuous decrease in the size of the forces and the intensity of the military pressure over the past months - has kept us far away from achieving the war goals."

"This is directly connected to our moving away from arriving at a new hostage deal," he added.


The Hostages and Missing Families Forum released the following statement to the press:

In light of the news regarding the withdrawal of the maneuvering forces from Gaza, the Hostage and Missing Families Forum reminds us that the IDF entered Gaza after October 7 to bring about a complete victory for the State of Israel

The government's decision to withdraw the maneuvering forces from Gaza and switch to ongoing defense proves that the IDF was able to bring Israel many achievements and victories in the military arena and undermine Hamas' capabilities.

The Prime Minister and the War Cabinet - it's time to bring the State of Israel to absolute victory! The departure of the maneuvering forces should be the first step in the deal. Now, the hostages in Gaza must not be left behind!
Posted By: dawglover05 Re: Israel at war again. - 04/07/24 05:38 PM
Originally Posted by Clemdawg
Sincere question:
Do you belong to a "Last Days" Ministry?


[Y/N]

I was going to guess some sort of fundamentalist baptist sect, but that’s a legit question.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/07/24 06:33 PM
José Andrés: Let People Eat

In the worst conditions you can imagine — after hurricanes, earthquakes, bombs
and gunfire — the best of humanity shows up. Not once or twice but always.
The seven people killed on a World Central Kitchen mission in Gaza on Monday
were the best of humanity. They are not faceless or nameless. They are not generic
aid workers or collateral damage in war.

Saifeddin Issam Ayad Abutaha, John Chapman, Jacob Flickinger, Zomi Frankcom,
James Henderson, James Kirby and Damian Sobol risked everything for the most
fundamentally human activity: to share our food with others.

These are people I served alongside in Ukraine, Turkey, Morocco, the Bahamas,
Indonesia, Mexico, Gaza and Israel. They were far more than heroes.

Their work was based on the simple belief that food is a universal human right. It is
not conditional on being good or bad, rich or poor, left or right. We do not ask what
religion you belong to. We just ask how many meals you need.

From Day 1, we have fed Israelis as well as Palestinians. Across Israel, we have
served more than 1.75 million hot meals. We have fed families displaced by
Hezbollah rockets in the north. We have fed grieving families from the south. We
delivered meals to the hospitals where hostages were reunited with their families.
We have called consistently, repeatedly and passionately for the release of all the
hostages.

All the while, we have communicated extensively with Israeli military and civilian
officials. At the same time, we have worked closely with community leaders in
Gaza, as well as Arab nations in the region. There is no way to bring a ship full of
food to Gaza without doing so.

That’s how we served more than 43 million meals in Gaza, preparing hot food in 68
community kitchens where Palestinians are feeding Palestinians.
We know Israelis. Israelis, in their heart of hearts, know that food is not a weapon
of war.

Israel is better than the way this war is being waged. It is better than blocking food
and medicine to civilians. It is better than killing aid workers who had coordinated
their movements with the Israel Defense Forces.

The Israeli government needs to open more land routes for food and medicine
today. It needs to stop killing civilians and aid workers today. It needs to start the
long journey to peace today.

In the worst conditions, after the worst terrorist attack in its history, it’s time for
the best of Israel to show up. You cannot save the hostages by bombing every
building in Gaza. You cannot win this war by starving an entire population.

We welcome the government’s promise of an investigation into how and why
members of our World Central Kitchen family were killed. That investigation needs
to start at the top, not just the bottom.

Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has said of the Israeli killings of our team, “It
happens in war.” It was a direct attack on clearly marked vehicles whose
movements were known by the Israel Defense Forces.

It was also the direct result of a policy that squeezed humanitarian aid to desperate
levels. Our team was en route from a delivery of almost 400 tons of aid by sea —
our second shipment, funded by the United Arab Emirates, supported by Cyprus
and with clearance from the Israel Defense Forces.

The team members put their lives at risk precisely because this food aid is so rare
and desperately needed. According to the Integrated Food Security Phase
Classification global initiative, half the population of Gaza — 1.1. million people —
faces the imminent risk of famine. The team would not have made the journey if
there were enough food, traveling by truck across land, to feed the people of Gaza.

The peoples of the Mediterranean and Middle East, regardless of ethnicity and
religion, share a culture that values food as a powerful statement of humanity and
hospitality — of our shared hope for a better tomorrow.

There’s a reason, at this special time of year, Christians make Easter eggs, Muslims
eat an egg at iftar dinners and an egg sits on the Seder plate. This symbol of life
and hope reborn in spring extends across religions and cultures.

I have been a stranger at Seder dinners. I have heard the ancient Passover stories
about being a stranger in the land of Egypt, the commandment to remember —
with a feast before you — that the children of Israel were once slaves.

It is not a sign of weakness to feed strangers; it is a sign of strength. The people of
Israel need to remember, at this darkest hour, what strength truly looks like.

https://worldcentralkitchen.cdn.prismic.io/worldcentralkitchen/Zg8DyhrFxhpPBUSx_Opinion_Jose%CC%81Andre%CC%81s_LetPeopleEat-TheNewYorkTimes.pdf
Posted By: Day of the Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/08/24 03:59 PM
Originally Posted by Clemdawg
Sincere question:
Do you belong to a "Last Days" Ministry?


[Y/N]

No. Non-Denominational. But I do believe we are living in the last days. I believe the rapture of the church will be happening very soon and the anti christ will be coming on the scene soon after. I believe the globalist movement in the world is a set up for him to take over.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/08/24 04:07 PM
But what one religion is the true religion? If every other religion is wrong, will they too be called up in the rapture? And does supporting Israel starve women and children secure your place in heaven?
Posted By: Day of the Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/08/24 04:46 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
But what one religion is the true religion? If every other religion is wrong, will they too be called up in the rapture? And does supporting Israel starve women and children secure your place in heaven?

There is only one church that was established and created by God thru the new covenant of Jesus Christ sacrifice and resurrection. He was a willing sacrifice. A sinless man that paid the ultimate price for all of the sins of the entire world. Then defeating death and the grave by his resurrection. It is also the only religion that has historical evidence to support this crucifixion. Then the accounts of his resurrection were recorded by people who witnessed him live and in person living after he was crucified. The Muslim religion did not write about Muhammed being resurrected until 150 years after the fact. Not eyewitness accounts. There is only one way to heaven that that is accepting that he died for your sins and rose again for your salvation. So, the answer to will others be raptured is No they will not, but everyone has had the opportunity to accept that free gift. It is also God's hope that everyone will accept it, but he gives people the free will to make their own choice and decisions. Coolest thing is we all decide where we spend eternity.

As far as starving women and children. I am sure he hates what is happening but like most people who know and understand what happened on October 7th it is Hamas's fault and not Israel. Israel leadership has to do what is best for its people and there are always casualties of war and the terrorist caused this not Israel.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/08/24 04:54 PM
Originally Posted by Day of the Dawg
As far as starving women and children. I am sure he hates what is happening but like most people who know and understand what happened on October 7th it is Hamas's fault and not Israel. Israel leadership has to do what is best for its people and there are always casualties of war and the terrorist caused this not Israel.

Starving innocent women and children is a choice Netanyahu made. Not Israeli citizens. Somehow you can't seem to separate Palestinian civilians from Hamas in your thinking. Hamas didn't force Netanyahu to starve all of those people. The terrorists don't force anyone to cut of humanitarian aid to women and children. The, "Johny made me do it" defense doesn't work.
Posted By: Day of the Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/08/24 04:59 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Originally Posted by Day of the Dawg
As far as starving women and children. I am sure he hates what is happening but like most people who know and understand what happened on October 7th it is Hamas's fault and not Israel. Israel leadership has to do what is best for its people and there are always casualties of war and the terrorist caused this not Israel.

Starving innocent women and children is a choice Netanyahu made. Not Israeli citizens. Somehow you can't seem to separate Palestinian civilians from Hamas in your thinking. Hamas didn't force Netanyahu to starve all of those people. The terrorists don't force anyone to cut of humanitarian aid to women and children. The, "Johny made me do it" defense doesn't work.

Netanyahu is trying to win a war he must win for the safety of his citizens. War is ugly. In the grand scheme of things there is no rules to war it is win or lose. Win and to the victor comes the spoils. Lose and pay the price. He must win. Those being starved is a result of what Hamas did. By your fake outrage Harry Truman would have been wrong dropping the Adam bomb on Japan. It did end that war though.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/08/24 05:32 PM
So starving innocent women and children is fake outrage? No rules for war?

What is the international rule of war?

International humanitarian law (IHL) – known also as the Law of Armed Conflict or the Law of War – is the body of international rules that in time of armed conflict protects those who do not, or can no longer, participate in hostilities, such as civilians, the wounded and prisoners of war.

Every state in the world has adhered to the Geneva Conventions and although not all states are yet parties to the two Additional Protocols of 1977, many of the rules set out in these instruments enjoy the status of customary international law applicable to all states.

The parties to a conflict must at all times distinguish between the civilian population and combatants in order to spare the civilian population and civilian property. Neither the civilian population as a whole, nor individual civilians, may be attacked. Attacks may only be made against military objectives.

People who do not or can no longer take part in hostilities are entitled to respect for their lives and for their physical and psychological wellbeing. They must in all circumstances be protected and treated with humanity, without distinction. It is forbidden to kill or wound an enemy who surrenders or who can no longer take part in the fighting.

Neither the parties to the conflict nor members of their armed forces have an unlimited right to choose methods and means of warfare. It is forbidden to use weapons or methods of warfare that are likely to cause unnecessary losses or excessive suffering.

The wounded and sick must be collected and cared for by the party to the conflict which has them in its power. Medical personnel and medical facilities and vehicles may not be attacked. Personnel wearing the distinctive emblem of the Red Cross, Red Crescent or Red Crystal on white backgrounds, and facilities and vehicles bearing the emblems, must be respected.

https://www.ireland.ie/en/dfa/role-...onal-law/international-humanitarian-law/

I guess of course if you wish to conduct yourself the way terrorists do........
Posted By: Swish Re: Israel at war again. - 04/08/24 05:42 PM
This kind of rhetoric is why the US continues losing support around the world. Blind eyes to Israeli war crimes is sickening.
Posted By: WooferDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/08/24 05:48 PM
Originally Posted by Day of the Dawg
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Originally Posted by Day of the Dawg
I don't believe terror organizations like Hamas and Hezbollah or an axis of evil nation like Iran's point of view really matter. Israel is a Sovereign nation and being a sovereign nation they have a right to defend themselves.

Starving Palestinian women and children and denying them medical supplies is not defending yourself.

I blame Hamas for the starving of the Palestinian civilians. They caused the war. They have stolen money for years purposed for Palestinian civilians and used it for self-gain and military purposes. But go ahead and believe all the anti-Israel propaganda.

Is Hamas blocking access to Gaza? Technically speaking its as though the United States would be cutting off one of the States (say Florida as an example) and blockading the ports of entry.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/08/24 05:59 PM
No Hamas is not blocking aid to Gaza. Israel controls everything that goes in and out of Gaza. They are blocking food and medical supplies from crossing the border into into Gaza at a rate than can sustain the Palestinian civilians.................

“With Nasser and the European Gaza Hospital almost inaccessible, there is no longer a health care system in Gaza. These systematic attacks against health care are unacceptable and must end now so that the wounded can get the care they need. The entire health system has been rendered inoperative.”

https://www.doctorswithoutborders.o...cutting-access-health-care-southern-gaza
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/08/24 06:01 PM
Originally Posted by Swish
This kind of rhetoric is why the US continues losing support around the world. Blind eyes to Israeli war crimes is sickening.

And the situation in Ukraine is no different. "We will be your allies and help support your efforts to fight Russian invaders. Until we decide we won't."

The U.S. can no longer be depended upon to keep their word.
Posted By: WooferDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/09/24 04:30 AM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
No Hamas is not blocking aid to Gaza. Israel controls everything that goes in and out of Gaza. They are blocking food and medical supplies from crossing the border into into Gaza at a rate than can sustain the Palestinian civilians.................

“With Nasser and the European Gaza Hospital almost inaccessible, there is no longer a health care system in Gaza. These systematic attacks against health care are unacceptable and must end now so that the wounded can get the care they need. The entire health system has been rendered inoperative.”

https://www.doctorswithoutborders.o...cutting-access-health-care-southern-gaza

I get it and knew the answer. It’s the context of the response. DoD can blame Hamas, but Israel is responsible for the blockade and its military actions.

Yes, Hamas started the fight and as long as they hold hostages the fight will continue. That much is certain. But Israel has lost credibility in the world because of its brutal response and risks sanctions (no military supplies) or intervention to stop the carnage. But I will reiterate, the fight will continue until the hostage situation is resolved.
Posted By: Pdawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/13/24 02:02 AM
Posted By: northlima dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/13/24 08:29 PM
Iran has just launched drones.
Will take several hours

Not launched any cruise missles.
Biden and the team have already assembled
Posted By: Pdawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/13/24 11:33 PM
Posted By: mac Re: Israel at war again. - 04/14/24 03:41 AM
I expect Israel to respond to this Iranian attack, even though Iran's attack failed to produce the desired results.

Hopefully Netanyahu will be satisfied with Israel's successful defense that appears to have repelled Iran's attack and not escalate the situation further.
Posted By: Ballpeen Re: Israel at war again. - 04/14/24 09:47 AM
Originally Posted by mac
I expect Israel to respond to this Iranian attack, even though Iran's attack failed to produce the desired results.

Hopefully Netanyahu will be satisfied with Israel's successful defense that appears to have repelled Iran's attack and not escalate the situation further.

I hope so. If not it is one more step in to us stumbling in to a world war.

The Middle East blowing up, eastern Europe in conflict. Tensions high with China over Tiawan. Bar fights can escalate quickly with a thrown bottle here or a swing of a pool cue there.
Posted By: Swish Re: Israel at war again. - 04/14/24 01:57 PM
Jc

I think it’s interesting that Iran completely telegraphed their attack, using an attack that’s easily defendable.

Israel, Jordan, UK and US all were in on shooting down the missiles and drones launched at Israel, and they took out damn near all of them.

Not saying Iran capable of more, but this attack was clearly one meant to save face, not actually be a retaliatory assault. Iran isn’t interested in an actual war against the West.
Posted By: Bull_Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/14/24 02:34 PM
Originally Posted by Swish
Jc

I think it’s interesting that Iran completely telegraphed their attack, using an attack that’s easily defendable.

Israel, Jordan, UK and US all were in on shooting down the missiles and drones launched at Israel, and they took out damn near all of them.

Not saying Iran capable of more, but this attack was clearly one meant to save face, not actually be a retaliatory assault. Iran isn’t interested in an actual war against the West.

Or the Iranian military industrial complex exerted pressure for profit.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/14/24 03:19 PM
Originally Posted by Swish
Jc

I think it’s interesting that Iran completely telegraphed their attack, using an attack that’s easily defendable.

Israel, Jordan, UK and US all were in on shooting down the missiles and drones launched at Israel, and they took out damn near all of them.

Not saying Iran capable of more, but this attack was clearly one meant to save face, not actually be a retaliatory assault. Iran isn’t interested in an actual war against the West.

This is the most accurate post I have seen about this entire situation.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/14/24 03:20 PM
Originally Posted by Bull_Dawg
Or the Iranian military industrial complex exerted pressure for profit.

rofl

At least I'm hoping you were being satirical.
Posted By: Bull_Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/14/24 04:04 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Originally Posted by Bull_Dawg
Or the Iranian military industrial complex exerted pressure for profit.

rofl

At least I'm hoping you were being satirical.

Not entirely. Was more piggybacking on what Swish said. Why just save face when you can save face and make money?

Edit: Iranian drone industry Link Based on that it looks like IRGC generals are actually in leadership positions of privately held companies that sell drones and related services to the Iranian government.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/14/24 04:19 PM
Yet Iran hasn't made a strike on Israel until Israel bombed their consulate. I sort if understand where you're coming from however. Much like the U.S. they supply weapons to other nations and groups who share their interests. So I can see where you may draw your conclusion from. I do not however think that can be based on this strike alone.
Posted By: northlima dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/14/24 04:33 PM
Originally Posted by Ballpeen
Originally Posted by mac
I expect Israel to respond to this Iranian attack, even though Iran's attack failed to produce the desired results.

Hopefully Netanyahu will be satisfied with Israel's successful defense that appears to have repelled Iran's attack and not escalate the situation further.

I hope so. If not it is one more step in to us stumbling in to a world war.

The Middle East blowing up, eastern Europe in conflict. Tensions high with China over Tiawan. Bar fights can escalate quickly with a thrown bottle here or a swing of a pool cue there.

Doesn't seem like Israel is done yet. The war cabinet approved a "powerful response"
Posted By: northlima dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/14/24 04:35 PM
Originally Posted by Swish
Jc

I think it’s interesting that Iran completely telegraphed their attack, using an attack that’s easily defendable.

Israel, Jordan, UK and US all were in on shooting down the missiles and drones launched at Israel, and they took out damn near all of them.

Not saying Iran capable of more, but this attack was clearly one meant to save face, not actually be a retaliatory assault. Iran isn’t interested in an actual war against the West.

Very true... and then it seemed Iran was showing its people damage/fires from another event and saying it was damage in Israel.
Posted By: northlima dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/14/24 04:40 PM
Also, last night after the main wave was over, a batch of a couple dozen missiles were launched from Lebanon. Israel attacked northern Lebanon where they were launched from.

It won't be dark for a few more hours over there.
I don't like what I am seeing/hearing online that Israel is targeting Iran homeland nuke sites; that would not be an "in kind" response to the lame effort Iran put forth last night and definitely would escalate the situation.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/14/24 06:24 PM
US will not take part in retaliatory action against Iran, White House says

JERUSALEM/DUBAI/WASHINGTON, April 14 (Reuters) - President Joe Biden warned Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu the U.S. will not take part in a counter-offensive against Iran if Israel decides to retaliate for a mass drone and missile attack on Israeli territory overnight, a White House official said.

The threat of open warfare erupting between the arch Middle East foes and dragging in the United States has put the region on edge, triggering calls for restraint from global powers and Arab nations to avoid further escalation.

U.S. media reported earlier on Sunday that Biden had informed Netanyahu he would not participate in retaliatory action in a phone call overnight. The remarks were confirmed to Reuters by a White House official.

The U.S. will continue to help Israel defend itself, but does not want war, John Kirby, the White House's top national security spokesperson, told ABC's "This Week" program on Sunday.

Iran launched the attack over a suspected Israeli strike on its consulate in Syria on April 1 that killed top Revolutionary Guards commanders and followed months of clashes between Israel and Iran's regional allies, triggered by the war in Gaza.

However, the attack from more than 300 missiles and drones, mostly launched from inside Iran, caused only modest damage in Israel as most were shot down with the help of the U.S., Britain and Jordan.
An Air Force base in southern Israel was hit, but continued to operate as normal and a 7-year old child was seriously hurt by shrapnel. There were no other reports of serious damage.

Two senior Israeli ministers signalled on Sunday that retaliation by Israel is not imminent and it would not act alone.

"We will build a regional coalition and exact the price from Iran in the fashion and timing that is right for us," centrist minister Benny Gantz said ahead of a war cabinet meeting.

Defence Minister Yoav Gallant also said Israel had an opportunity to form a strategic alliance against "against this grave threat by Iran which is threatening to mount nuclear explosives on these missiles, which could be an extremely grave threat," he said. Iran denies seeking nuclear weapons.

Iranian army chief of staff Major General Mohammad Bagheri warned on television that "our response will be much larger than tonight's military action if Israel retaliates against Iran" and told Washington its bases could also be attacked if it helped Israel retaliate.

Iranian Foreign Minister Amir Abdollahian said Tehran had informed the United States its attack on Israel would be "limited" and for self defence and that regional neighbours had also been informed of its planned strikes 72-hours in advance.

A Turkish diplomatic source said Iran had informed Turkey in advance of what would happen.

Iran said the attack was aimed at punishing "Israeli crimes" but it now "deemed the matter concluded."

Russia, China, France and Germany as well as Arab states Egypt, Qatar and the United Arab Emirates urged restraint and the U.N. Security Council was set to meet at 4 p.m. ET (2000 GMT) on Sunday.

"We will do everything to stop a further escalation," German Chancellor Olaf Scholz said on a visit to China. "We can only warn everyone, especially Iran, against continuing this way."

Turkey also warned Iran it did not want further tension in the region.

ESCALATION

Analysts debated how far Iran's attack was calibrated to cause genuine devastation in Israel, or to save face at home after vows of revenge while avoiding a major new war.

"I think the Iranians took into consideration the fact that Israel has a very, very strong multi-layer anti-missile system and they probably took into consideration that there will not be too many casualties," said Sima Shine, a former senior Mossad official at the Institute for National Security Studies in Tel Aviv.

But if Iran was hoping for a muted response, like with its missile attacks on U.S. forces in Iraq after the killing of Guards commander Qassem Soleimani in 2020, she warned "I don't think Israel sees it this way".

On Saturday Iran's Revolutionary Guards seized an Israel-linked cargo ship in the Strait of Hormuz, one of the world's most important energy shipping routes, underscoring the risks to the world economy of a wider conflict.

Some flights were suspended in countries across the region and share prices fell in stock markets in Israel and Gulf states.

The war in Gaza, which Israel invaded after an attack by Iran-backed Hamas on Oct. 7, has spread to fronts with Iran-aligned groups in Lebanon, Syria, Yemen and Iraq.

Iran's most powerful ally in the region, the Lebanese Shi'ite group Hezbollah fired rockets at an Israeli base overnight. Israel said it struck a Hezbollah site deep inside Lebanon on Sunday morning.
Yemen's Houthis, who have been firing missiles at ships in the Red Sea in what they say is support for the Palestinians, called Iran's attack legitimate.

The Oct. 7 attack in which Israel says 1,200 were killed and 253 taken hostage, along with internal discontent with the government and international pressure over the war in Gaza, form the backdrop to Netanyahu's decisions over a response. At least 33,000 people have been killed in Gaza since Israel began its military offensive, according to authorities in the enclave.

The Israeli prime minister has for years advocated a tough military line against Iran, pushing the United States for harder action over Tehran's nuclear programme and its backing for Hezbollah, Hamas and other groups in the region.

In Israel, although there was alarm at the first direct attack from another country in more than three decades, the mood was in contrast to the trauma after the Hamas-led attack on Oct.7.

"I think we've been given license to respond now. I mean it was a major attack from Iran... I imagine Israel will respond and may be over quickly and get back to normal life," said Jeremy Smith, 60.

In Iran, state television showed small gatherings in several cities celebrating the attack, but in private some Iranians were worried about Israel's response.

"Iran gave Netanyahu a golden opportunity to attack our country. But we, the people of Iran, will bear the brunt of this conflict," said Shima, a 29-year-old nurse, from Tehran.

https://www.reuters.com/world/middl...es-fears-wider-conflict-grow-2024-04-14/
Posted By: jfanent Re: Israel at war again. - 04/14/24 09:59 PM
Originally Posted by northlima dawg
Also, last night after the main wave was over, a batch of a couple dozen missiles were launched from Lebanon. Israel attacked northern Lebanon where they were launched from.

It won't be dark for a few more hours over there.
I don't like what I am seeing/hearing online that Israel is targeting Iran homeland nuke sites; that would not be an "in kind" response to the lame effort Iran put forth last night and definitely would escalate the situation.

It's also not uncharted territory for Israel. Back in 1981 they launched a raid against nuclear facility in Iraq. The raid "established the Begin Doctrine, which explicitly stated the strike was not an anomaly, but instead "a precedent for every future government in Israel". Israel's counter-proliferation preventive strike added another dimension to its existing policy of deliberate ambiguity, as it related to the nuclear weapons capability of other states in the region."
Posted By: EveDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/14/24 10:04 PM
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...on-Iran-launched-350-missile-attack.html

Biden is so weak. The rest of the G7 have a spine at least.
Posted By: Day of the Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/14/24 11:52 PM
Originally Posted by EveDawg
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...on-Iran-launched-350-missile-attack.html

Biden is so weak. The rest of the G7 have a spine at least.

Biden is a coward. Iran is the head of the snake in the middle east. They fund the terrorist organizations that cause Israel many issues. They fund Hamas, they fund Hezbollah, and the Houthis. I hope Israel blasts their nuclear weapons sites. If Iran was to complete a nuke they would not hesitate to take Israel out or hit us here in the states.
Posted By: Swish Re: Israel at war again. - 04/15/24 10:40 AM
Originally Posted by Day of the Dawg
Originally Posted by EveDawg
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...on-Iran-launched-350-missile-attack.html

Biden is so weak. The rest of the G7 have a spine at least.

Biden is a coward. Iran is the head of the snake in the middle east. They fund the terrorist organizations that cause Israel many issues. They fund Hamas, they fund Hezbollah, and the Houthis. I hope Israel blasts their nuclear weapons sites. If Iran was to complete a nuke they would not hesitate to take Israel out or hit us here in the states.

How is he a coward? For not wanting to escalate the conflict?

Iran launched a retaliatory strike in response to Israel killing their general. Their counter strike failed spectacularly.

If Israel retaliates to the retaliation, it’s not a counter strike; it’s escalation. You conservatives clown Biden for apparently getting us into conflicts, then out of nowhere claim he’s too cowardly to engage in conflicts. Pick a narrative.

Imagine being so weak and clueless that you believe not responding to a failed counter strike is cowardly.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/15/24 12:31 PM
Wow, OUR Commander-in-Chief, President Joe Biden, sure put on a master class in defending our allies and keeping things from escalating out of hand this past weekend. Meanwhile senile Trump slurred and made crap up all through his speech in PA. This is what presidents do, they don’t cower to strong men trash like Putin, who is in bed with IRAN. If you support Putin, Trump’s puppet master, then you ARE traitorous trash. Have a good whatever, until I pop in agian.
Posted By: Bull_Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/15/24 01:31 PM
Originally Posted by Swish
Originally Posted by Day of the Dawg
Originally Posted by EveDawg
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...on-Iran-launched-350-missile-attack.html

Biden is so weak. The rest of the G7 have a spine at least.

Biden is a coward. Iran is the head of the snake in the middle east. They fund the terrorist organizations that cause Israel many issues. They fund Hamas, they fund Hezbollah, and the Houthis. I hope Israel blasts their nuclear weapons sites. If Iran was to complete a nuke they would not hesitate to take Israel out or hit us here in the states.

How is he a coward? For not wanting to escalate the conflict?

Iran launched a retaliatory strike in response to Israel killing their general. Their counter strike failed spectacularly.

If Israel retaliates to the retaliation, it’s not a counter strike; it’s escalation. You conservatives clown Biden for apparently getting us into conflicts, then out of nowhere claim he’s too cowardly to engage in conflicts. Pick a narrative.

Imagine being so weak and clueless that you believe not responding to a failed counter strike is cowardly.

Some see the Iranian missile attack as the escalation. Taking out the general is seen by some as retaliation for his coordination of terrorist attacks. It's a matter of perspective.

Unfortunately, Netanyahu seems much more concerned with not looking like a coward than Biden.

...what conflict did Biden get us in?

He's the placating President. He sends money so he doesn't actually have to make a hard decision and join a conflict.

He does just enough to let conflicts drag on.

He's the spend money to not actually solve problems President. Spend money so someone can keep making money. I'm not sure it's cowardly. It does seem somewhat ineffectual, though. At least as far as the conflicts themselves are concerned.

Sadly, it seems an ineffectual President is the best we can hope for these days.

I'm not saying Biden should go fire and brimstone or invade Iran, but what word would you use to describe him?
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 04/15/24 02:40 PM
Quote
He's the placating President. He sends money

Another false statement. But please continue your BS. I’m grabbing my popcorn and headed over to watch the GOPer leading candidate choice in a criminal trial for falsifying documents about paying off a porn star he screwed over and over to stay silent about it.

That’s the GOPer choice. But Biden Biden Biden. He so bad.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/15/24 02:43 PM
Yeah, sending in our troops would be such a great idea. Escalating a war in the middle east is such a wonderful idea. How quickly people forget.

Quote
Taking out the general is seen by some as retaliation for his coordination of terrorist attacks.

Thus far I've seen zero evidence that Iran coordinated any terrorist attacks on Israel. It's true they have supplied weaponry but nothing indicates they coordinated any attacks.

Anyone who doesn't see Israels bombing of the Iran consulate as an escalation isn't being objective.

Iran made sure to telegraph this move. They allowed everyone to be ready to defend it. That's not how anyone trying to inflict as much damage as possible would have approached this.

We are actually one of less than a hand full of nations that helped Israel fight off the attack by Iran.

If you actually believe that trying to dissuade a war in the middle east from happening makes someone look cowardly I think you've been drinking too much of the kool aid.
Posted By: Bull_Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/15/24 02:52 PM
Originally Posted by PerfectSpiral
Quote
He's the placating President. He sends money

Another false statement. But please continue your BS. I’m grabbing my popcorn.

What's false about it?

Have we not sent aid packages to Israel and Ukraine? Did he not sign the legislation?

You might not like the characterization. That doesn't make it not true.

Edit: You added more after I replied and of course unchecked the mark as edited box. It still applies no matter how much you try to deflect by pointing at Trump. Pointing at how bad Trump is has no effect on Biden's actions or lack thereof.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 04/15/24 02:53 PM
We…US. is not one person. And what would you have Biden do veto aid to our allies that was approved in the house and senate?
Posted By: Bull_Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/15/24 03:00 PM
Originally Posted by PerfectSpiral
We…US. is not one person.

No one said it was. Yet, he's the figurehead/"QB" of "US." He gets the credit, he gets the blame. That's the job. He's allowed to veto/try to call an audible. He's the one that signs at the end/hikes the ball.

You don't have to like it. I don't have to like it. That doesn't change the facts.

Edit: Another lovely post-post edit presented as original. It doesn't matter what I would have him do. That doesn't change what he did.

I never claimed it was bad/wrong here.
Posted By: Bull_Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/15/24 03:22 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Yeah, sending in our troops would be such a great idea. Escalating a war in the middle east is such a wonderful idea. How quickly people forget.

Quote
Taking out the general is seen by some as retaliation for his coordination of terrorist attacks.

Thus far I've seen zero evidence that Iran coordinated any terrorist attacks on Israel. It's true they have supplied weaponry but nothing indicates they coordinated any attacks.

Anyone who doesn't see Israels bombing of the Iran consulate as an escalation isn't being objective.

Iran made sure to telegraph this move. They allowed everyone to be ready to defend it. That's not how anyone trying to inflict as much damage as possible would have approached this.

We are actually one of less than a hand full of nations that helped Israel fight off the attack by Iran.

If you actually believe that trying to dissuade a war in the middle east from happening makes someone look cowardly I think you've been drinking too much of the kool aid.

I never said to send troops to Iran. I explicitly stated not to invade Iran. Nice straw man rolleyes

You not seeing something doesn't mean it doesn't exist. I'm not saying it does, but your lack of seeing it from Tennessee is hardly a strong argument.

Who claimed it was objective? I wrote that how the missile attack was seen was subjective. Most things are seen subjectively. The idea that anyone looking at what happened is objective is pretty much BS. Most people carry their biases with them.

Iran may know their general got caught. Yet, they can't admit it publicly. They had to "retaliate" to maintain the charade that they were unaware of his involvement with proxy combatants and to "save face" whether true or not. Yet, they also didn't want to get bombed back to the Stone Age, so they, perhaps, essentially held a training exercise not designed to do maximum damage.

I wrote that cowardly was probably not the right word. Somehow you twist that to me believing Biden's cowardly. Talk about not being objective.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/15/24 03:37 PM
Originally Posted by Bull_Dawg
You not seeing something doesn't mean it doesn't exist. I'm not saying it does, but your lack of seeing it from Tennessee is hardly a strong argument.

You admitting you can't say it does exist means much more than my geographic location.

Quote
Who claimed it was objective? I wrote that how the missile attack was seen was subjective. Most things are seen subjectively. The idea that anyone looking at what happened is objective is pretty much BS. Most people carry their biases with them.

Oh they're not being objective but they should be. A consulate by definition says that when Israel attacked the Iranian consulate it was a direct attack on Iran.....

A consulate is the place in a city where foreign government officials work and looks after all the people there who are from his or her own country.

Quote
Iran may know their general got caught. Yet, they can't admit it publicly. They had to "retaliate" to maintain the charade that they were unaware of his involvement with proxy combatants and to "save face" whether true or not. Yet, they also didn't want to get bombed back to the Stone Age, so they, perhaps, essentially held a training exercise not designed to do maximum damage.

I hope everyone understands that pulling out some theory out of the air with no basis in facts to support it is why so many people buy into false information and conspiracies. There isn't an ounce of evidence to support anything you said in that quote.

Quote
I wrote that cowardly was probably not the right word. Somehow you twist that to me believing Biden's cowardly. Talk about not being objective.

So you admit that was the wrong word and then blame me for pointing out what you said?

Quote
Unfortunately, Netanyahu seems much more concerned with not looking like a coward than Biden.

You do realize that I based my comment on something there is at least some evidence of rather than the off the wall "may know" theory you concocted with zero evidence to support it, correct?
Posted By: Bull_Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/15/24 04:04 PM
Read up. I didn't just pull the theory out of thin air.

NYT: Iranian Generals Killed in Syria Link

Edit: The difference between our approaches is that I admit that I don't know everything. I write what I think and am clear that it's just what I think. You seem to think you are always right, especially when you aren't. Then you make straw man arguments.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/15/24 04:49 PM
I saw nothing in your source that would indicate that Iran coordinated the attack of Israel by Hamas. I saw nothing that indicated they coordinated the the effort in Syria to help keep Bashar Assad in power. Yes they gave support for it. They aided the side that fought to keep him in power. But none of that has anything to do with Israel nor shows they initiated that fight much less coordinated it.

I don't nor would I ever debate that Iran has backed and supported the factions that have been at odds with Israel. Hamas, Hezbollah and maybe even the Houthis. I've however have not seen any evidence that would in any way support that Iran had a hand in helping coordinate the attack against Israel on Oct. 7th.

So it's not as if I don't see why Israel would conduct such a strike but making some claim that entertains Iran helped coordinate the Hamas attack on Israel is a reach of gigantic proportions. What I also find hard to believe is that this isn't seen as an escalation in the conflict. Whether one considers the action proper or not, up until that point in time no direct attack on Israel had been conducted by Iran. This was the first time that either nation conducted an attack on their counterpart. Whether you consider Israel as being in the right or in the wrong that is most certainly escalating the situation.

I would like for you to explain how "I think I'm right" here? You pulled a theory out of thin air and I'm simply pointing that out. I don't know exactly what happened. The only difference is I'm not making up some concocted theory with nothing to base it on. All I've said is that "I've seen no evidence that supports your theory". And thus far there isn't any.

There's no need in you getting all upset because you can't support your theory. It is what it is.
Posted By: Swish Re: Israel at war again. - 04/15/24 05:00 PM
Originally Posted by Bull_Dawg
Originally Posted by Swish
Originally Posted by Day of the Dawg
Originally Posted by EveDawg
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...on-Iran-launched-350-missile-attack.html

Biden is so weak. The rest of the G7 have a spine at least.

Biden is a coward. Iran is the head of the snake in the middle east. They fund the terrorist organizations that cause Israel many issues. They fund Hamas, they fund Hezbollah, and the Houthis. I hope Israel blasts their nuclear weapons sites. If Iran was to complete a nuke they would not hesitate to take Israel out or hit us here in the states.

How is he a coward? For not wanting to escalate the conflict?

Iran launched a retaliatory strike in response to Israel killing their general. Their counter strike failed spectacularly.

If Israel retaliates to the retaliation, it’s not a counter strike; it’s escalation. You conservatives clown Biden for apparently getting us into conflicts, then out of nowhere claim he’s too cowardly to engage in conflicts. Pick a narrative.

Imagine being so weak and clueless that you believe not responding to a failed counter strike is cowardly.

Some see the Iranian missile attack as the escalation. Taking out the general is seen by some as retaliation for his coordination of terrorist attacks. It's a matter of perspective.

Unfortunately, Netanyahu seems much more concerned with not looking like a coward than Biden.

...what conflict did Biden get us in?

He's the placating President. He sends money so he doesn't actually have to make a hard decision and join a conflict.

He does just enough to let conflicts drag on.

He's the spend money to not actually solve problems President. Spend money so someone can keep making money. I'm not sure it's cowardly. It does seem somewhat ineffectual, though. At least as far as the conflicts themselves are concerned.

Sadly, it seems an ineffectual President is the best we can hope for these days.

I'm not saying Biden should go fire and brimstone or invade Iran, but what word would you use to describe him?

He already looks like a tyrant with regards to Gaza. I don’t get your question as I was responding to Day, not you.

I really don’t know what to say to the rest of your post, as it amounts to petty insults toward Biden and misinformation on his strategy.
Posted By: Bull_Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/15/24 06:34 PM
Originally Posted by Swish
Originally Posted by Bull_Dawg
Originally Posted by Swish
Originally Posted by Day of the Dawg
Originally Posted by EveDawg
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...on-Iran-launched-350-missile-attack.html

Biden is so weak. The rest of the G7 have a spine at least.

Biden is a coward. Iran is the head of the snake in the middle east. They fund the terrorist organizations that cause Israel many issues. They fund Hamas, they fund Hezbollah, and the Houthis. I hope Israel blasts their nuclear weapons sites. If Iran was to complete a nuke they would not hesitate to take Israel out or hit us here in the states.

How is he a coward? For not wanting to escalate the conflict?

Iran launched a retaliatory strike in response to Israel killing their general. Their counter strike failed spectacularly.

If Israel retaliates to the retaliation, it’s not a counter strike; it’s escalation. You conservatives clown Biden for apparently getting us into conflicts, then out of nowhere claim he’s too cowardly to engage in conflicts. Pick a narrative.

Imagine being so weak and clueless that you believe not responding to a failed counter strike is cowardly.

Some see the Iranian missile attack as the escalation. Taking out the general is seen by some as retaliation for his coordination of terrorist attacks. It's a matter of perspective.

Unfortunately, Netanyahu seems much more concerned with not looking like a coward than Biden.

...what conflict did Biden get us in?

He's the placating President. He sends money so he doesn't actually have to make a hard decision and join a conflict.

He does just enough to let conflicts drag on.

He's the spend money to not actually solve problems President. Spend money so someone can keep making money. I'm not sure it's cowardly. It does seem somewhat ineffectual, though. At least as far as the conflicts themselves are concerned.

Sadly, it seems an ineffectual President is the best we can hope for these days.

I'm not saying Biden should go fire and brimstone or invade Iran, but what word would you use to describe him?

He already looks like a tyrant with regards to Gaza. I don’t get your question as I was responding to Day, not you.

I really don’t know what to say to the rest of your post, as it amounts to petty insults toward Biden and misinformation on his strategy.


It's a question. What's so hard to understand about it? It was in response to both you and Day. It's not trying to contradict you. It's an attempt to look at the topic from a different/multiple perspectives. To look at the actual actions and outcomes instead of the narratives each side has about them.

They're not petty insults. They're depressing observations from a different perspective than your own.

What word would you use to describe Biden?

Placating seems a pretty accurate one. The definition is "intended to make someone less hostile." He wants to help Ukraine without angering Russia. He wants to de-escalate tensions in the Middle East.

The actions were what they were. Both conflicts are still going on.

Maybe they are the right actions. Yet, the conflicts are still happening. It is what it is. I'm just trying to look beyond both sides' narratives.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/15/24 06:47 PM
The obvious answer is no U.S. president can control or dictate what other nations do. He can apply pressure and make public statements but not actually dictate what they decide to do. I do not think Biden advocating, and when we can supplying arms for Ukraine to fight against Russia does not anger Russia. Quite the opposite in fact. It does not have that impact any more than Iran arming Hezbollah with arms to fight Israel accomplishes not angering Israel.

I had no idea that advocating nations in the middle east find a solution besides an all out war in the region was a "depressing observation". What "side" thinks an all out war in the middle east is a better solution?
Posted By: Bull_Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/15/24 07:19 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
The obvious answer is no U.S. president can control or dictate what other nations do. He can apply pressure and make public statements but not actually dictate what they decide to do. I do not think Biden advocating, and when we can supplying arms for Ukraine to fight against Russia does not anger Russia. Quite the opposite in fact. It does not have that impact any more than Iran arming Hezbollah with arms to fight Israel accomplishes not angering Israel.

I had no idea that advocating nations in the middle east find a solution besides an all out war in the region was a "depressing observation". What "side" thinks an all out war in the middle east is a better solution?

Oh look more straw men.

The fact that the actions seem to have been ineffectual as both conflicts are still ongoing is depressing. Perhaps, you enjoy seeing death and destruction continuously in the news. I do not.

Honestly, I think Putin was more upset by the "crazy SOB" comment than by us sending support. The longer Ukraine fights, the more Ukrainians he can get rid of. Plus, he can "recycle" the scrap. Raw material might very well be more valuable to him than people. People he can replace. Natural resources are finite. It seems that is how Putin's mind works.
Posted By: EveDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/15/24 10:41 PM
Biden is obviously weak. "Dont" doesnt scare anyone. Iran did what they wanted to anyways. They blew him off.

Biden is also stupid. He broadcast to the world that he doesnt have Israel's back if they retaliate. You NEVER broadcast your war plans to the enemy. Biden is a laughing stock. It makes me think he was pandering to his base. Those hamassholes hate Joe no matter what he does. They wont vote for him.
Posted By: Swish Re: Israel at war again. - 04/15/24 10:57 PM
The POTUS, who already pulled us out of one war, is broadcasting to the world a call for deescalation between Iran and Israel.

Only to right wingers is that considered a bad thing.
Posted By: EveDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/15/24 11:08 PM
He is broadcasting to the world that he doesnt have his allys back. The rest of G7 said they will support Israel. Biden is a weak joke. Iran will only be more imboldened now.
Posted By: EveDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/15/24 11:20 PM
Just like his weak ass response when the houthis killed the American soldiers. He did NOTHING but play whack a mole for a few days.

He sucks. He has no leadership skills and he is so weak.
Posted By: EveDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/15/24 11:23 PM
Originally Posted by Swish
The POTUS, who already pulled us out of one war, is broadcasting to the world a call for deescalation between Iran and Israel.

Only to right wingers is that considered a bad thing.

Yeah we can talk about what a crappy job he did pulling out of Afghanastan. Americans DIED. Friendlies DIED. People were literally clinging to the outside of the planes as they took off. He left all the weapons behind for the Taliban to have. Biden is incompetant.
Posted By: Pdawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/16/24 12:57 AM
Posted By: Pdawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/16/24 12:58 AM
Posted By: Bull_Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/16/24 01:31 AM
Originally Posted by Swish
The POTUS, who already pulled us out of one war, is broadcasting to the world a call for deescalation between Iran and Israel.

Only to right wingers is that considered a bad thing.


...I see how it is. Now you're pro pulling out.
Posted By: Swish Re: Israel at war again. - 04/16/24 12:39 PM
That’s what she said
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/16/24 02:50 PM
Nothing will kill more people in Ukraine than denying them the proper weaponry to defend itself against a Russian invasion.

As for Eve's crazy as per usual rant, it is the U.S. that supplied them with the iron dome defense system that shot down all of those drones and missiles that were launched by Iran. It was the U.S. that shot down around 80 drones before they ever reached Israel. In her world not agreeing to help engage in an offensive war is a bad thing. Anyone supporting actions that will lead to yet another large scale war in the middle east is a certified idiot.
Posted By: Bull_Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/16/24 04:21 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Nothing will kill more people in Ukraine than denying them the proper weaponry to defend itself against a Russian invasion.

As for Eve's crazy as per usual rant, it is the U.S. that supplied them with the iron dome defense system that shot down all of those drones and missiles that were launched by Iran. It was the U.S. that shot down around 80 drones before they ever reached Israel. In her world not agreeing to help engage in an offensive war is a bad thing. Anyone supporting actions that will lead to yet another large scale war in the middle east is a certified idiot.

Weapons are only as good (or bad) as the people using them. Ukraine needs more good soldiers. If we're supporting the large scale warfare route, how to best achieve that, I don't know.

So if anyone supporting actions leading to war in the Middle East is an idiot, then what is anyone that is supporting action that perpetuates large scale war in Ukraine? The Middle East has pretty much been in a perpetual state of "war" since before most of us were alive. This is just the most recent intensification/battle. I think you and those you imply are idiots both have a tendency to think of things as simplified to a point that is out of proportion with reality.

It'd be great if there were no conflict in the Middle East. Unfortunately, that doesn't seem to be an actual option. Does the question become which less bad option do we support? Do we support our long time allies or the people that love to shout death to America? (I dislike these "simplified" "questions," too. But, I am trying to put my thoughts in a way that you can work with.)

Honestly, I don't know what we should do. I hate a lot of what Israel has been doing. Yet, if people's stated goal (or they support people whose stated goal) was to obliterate my country and they supported and perpetrated terrorist acts against my country, I probably wouldn't feel a ton of mercy towards them, either. Intellectually, sure. Emotionally, as explosions and gunfire and blood and death abound where you can breathe and taste it, I'd probably be understandably pissed. If someone helped plan the kidnapping and killing of a dozen of your and your friends' kids, you probably wouldn't want them to get away with it. With all the surrounding death, you probably wouldn't be in the most rational state. Unfortunately, that region of the world seems to be occupied/"led"/"controlled" by people who are largely irrational. The "mob mentality" appears to be at the wheel.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/16/24 06:51 PM
Oh dear Lord. Either a nation can better defend itself and cut their casualties when they are properly armed or not. Either more people get killed when they lack the proper weaponry or not.

As far as soldiers go in Ukraine their people aren't even draft eligible until they're 25 years old.

As far as Israel goes it seems some have convinced themselves that innocent women and children are the same as Hamas. As has been shown over and over again Israel has the weaponry to strategically target the enemy. If you don't beleive that just look at the strike that took place killing the people from WCK. Each vehicle hit with precision at different points in the convoy and no other damage. They were precision strikes. There was and is no need or legitimate reasons to be using 2000 lb. dumb bombs in highly residential areas. Starving all of those women and children is actually criminal.

The denial of humanitarian assistance as a crime under international law

30-09-1999 Article, International Review of the Red Cross, No. 835, by Christa Rottensteiner

https://www.icrc.org/en/doc/resources/documents/article/other/57jq32.htm

In our very own nation we often times disagree with the policy of our leaders and refuse to support who ever may be in power at the time. Depending on your politics may help determine which side and which leaders you refuse to support. That doesn't mean you don't support the people of our country or the country itself.

This is no different. You can support Israel, their right to defend themselves and their right to wipe out Hamas without supporting Netanyahu and some of the inhumane ways he has conducted this war.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/18/24 06:29 PM
I can’t help but smile about all the BS convo’s I’ve dodged on this issue. I’d like to help Pit and Fate bring peace to the middle east. Send the hard right Jews to live with Pit, and the GAZA protestors to live with fate. Those two guys know everything, they can sway minds and win hearts… rolleyes

I told you all, doesn’t matter what we think, BB is gonna do what BB is gonna do. He knows the US will NEVER stop being an ally. And I still don’t care what happens in GAZA because HAMAS in GAZA is homegrown. Sorry for the innocent lives lost or devastated, but it’s out of our hands decision wise. Out of Joe’s too, to an extent.

This is just another issue weaponized by the right. We all know the right couldn’t care less about actual people.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/18/24 06:37 PM
I say starving civilians is wrong. And you?
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/18/24 07:58 PM
I say you’re right, and hopefully those starving and the leaders they’ve supported for decades will take a lesson from all of this instead of acting like they’ve done no wrong.

But don’t look for sympathy from me, I’d glass most of the middle east and Asia if I made calls like this. Good thing reasonable people like Joe Biden are on the job. We are small fries and have zero say in how this pans out no matter how much you dwell on it. Me, I don’t like it but I know I’m not changing anything by driving myself nuts over it. I also don’t like the pro Hamas crap here, anymore than I like the pro Putin crap. Tlaib can fade into history as far as I’m concerned, just like the 2A crowd, MAGA dolts, anti-vaxxers, and all things Trump. AOC is the only squad member I truly like.

The only thing I hope happens out of this Israeli war, is that the government of Israel moves center and HAMAS goes away. Other than that, I don’t think about it much.
Posted By: northlima dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/19/24 01:54 AM
Israel has just hit Isfahan, Iran. Also unconfirmed strikes in Iraq and southern Syria
Posted By: EveDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/19/24 02:25 AM
Originally Posted by northlima dawg
Israel has just hit Isfahan, Iran. Also unconfirmed strikes in Iraq and southern Syria


https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...kes-Iran-war-Isfahan-rockets-tehran.html

Israel has balls. They know Iran is the the head of the snake and arent afraid to go after them.

Biden is so weak. He is afraid of Iran and it shows.
Posted By: Swish Re: Israel at war again. - 04/19/24 01:13 PM
Originally Posted by northlima dawg
Israel has just hit Isfahan, Iran. Also unconfirmed strikes in Iraq and southern Syria

And so far, no reported casualties, couple explosions, a few of Israelis missile/drones got shot down.

Looks like another ‘we did this to save face’ kinda strike.

Yawn.

Honestly Israel and Iran need to hug it out cause this is getting stupid.
Posted By: mac Re: Israel at war again. - 04/19/24 01:16 PM
It's so damn easy to start a war...and so damn hard to end a war.

Reacting out of emotion is the worst reason to start a war.

War is not a game...it is so easy to send someone else's loved one off to war...

...but how many who support war are willing risk their lives or the lives of their own 'loved ones' to fight the war some claim to support..?
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 04/19/24 01:54 PM
Originally Posted by Swish
Originally Posted by northlima dawg
Israel has just hit Isfahan, Iran. Also unconfirmed strikes in Iraq and southern Syria

And so far, no reported casualties, couple explosions, a few of Israelis missile/drones got shot down.

Looks like another ‘we did this to save face’ kinda strike.

Yawn.

Honestly Israel and Iran need to hug it out cause this is getting stupid.

You know what Ms Gump said about stupid? This stupidity has gone on for centuries.
Posted By: dawglover05 Re: Israel at war again. - 04/19/24 03:14 PM
At this point, they're both going to waste billions in materiel just to save face and accomplish nothing other than just that.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/19/24 03:15 PM
Originally Posted by OldColdDawg
I say you’re right, and hopefully those starving and the leaders they’ve supported for decades will take a lesson from all of this instead of acting like they’ve done no wrong.

Hamas has not allowed an election in 16 years. Try again.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/19/24 03:17 PM
Originally Posted by OldColdDawg
We are small fries and have zero say in how this pans out no matter how much you dwell on it. Me, I don’t like it but I know I’m not changing anything by driving myself nuts over it.

You have posted on this board for years about things you can't change or have any control over. So this is where you suddenly draw your line? lmao
Posted By: Bull_Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/19/24 06:42 PM
Originally Posted by dawglover05
At this point, they're both going to waste billions in materiel just to save face and accomplish nothing other than just that.

Sounds like what I was saying about our aid to Ukraine at one point.

It's not that simple, of course. Hard to know where either of the conflicts is going to go. What's the alternative to spending the money? The "status quo" doesn't seem to be something Israel is content to let stand. The "dam" broke. Now we've got to hope the water doesn't overflow the banks.

I do wonder how much Israel's actions are intended to convince countries that "support" Hamas to exert pressure towards hostage releases. Or what is the purpose? I don't doubt that saving face is a part of it, but I'm guessing there is more to it.
Posted By: Pdawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/19/24 07:22 PM
There has been a lot of talk of Nazis in Ukraine. This article explains a lot of it. I am skeptical of CNN but I’ll post anyway. Yes, I know Zelenskyy is Jewish.

A far-right battalion has a key role in Ukraine's resistance. Its neo-Nazi history has been exploited by Putin
Analysis by Tara John and Tim Lister, CNN
Updated 7:58 AM EDT, Wed March 30, 2022

(CNN) President Vladimir Putin framed the Russian invasion of Ukraine as a "special mission" to protect Russian speakers from genocide at the hands of ​"neo-Nazis."

In a speech broadcast minutes before the invasion began on February 24​, Putin said: "We will seek to demilitarize and denazify Ukraine," ignoring the fact that the country's president, Volodymyr Zelensky, is Jewish.

For the Kremlin, Exhibit A in this special mission is the far-right Azov movement, part of the military and political landscape in Ukraine for nearly a decade. ​

Members of the Azov regiment and veterans march with torches to celebrate Defender of Ukraine Day in Kyiv on October 14, 2016.
Members of the Azov regiment and veterans march with torches to celebrate Defender of Ukraine Day in Kyiv on October 14, 2016.

Azov's military and political wings formally separated in 2016, when the far-right National Corps party was founded. The Azov battalion had by then been integrated into the Ukrainian National Guard.

An effective fighting force that's very much involved in the current conflict, the battalion has a history of neo-Nazi leanings, which have not been entirely extinguished by its integration into the Ukrainian military. ​

In its heyday as an autonomous militia, the Azov Battalion was associated with White supremacists and neo-Nazi ideology and insignia. It was especially active in and around Mariupol in 2014 and 2015. CNN teams in the area at the time reported Azov's embrace of neo-Nazi emblems and paraphernalia.

After its integration into the Ukrainian National Guard, amid discussions in the US Congress about designating the Azov Movement a foreign terrorist organization, Ukraine's then minister of internal affairs, Arsen Avakov, defended the unit. "The shameful information campaign about the alleged spread of Nazi ideology (among Azov members) is a deliberate attempt to discredit the 'Azov' unit and the National Guard of Ukraine," he told the online newspaper Ukrayinska Pravda in 2019.

They tried to reveal what life was like under Russian occupation. Then they disappeared
They tried to reveal what life was like under Russian occupation. Then they disappeared
The battalion still operates as a relatively autonomous entity. It has been prominent in defending Mariupol in recent weeks, and its resistance has been widely praised by members of the government.

For Putin, who has falsely claimed Ukraine's government is run by "drug addicts and neo-Nazis," Azov presents an obvious target. Moscow has given the regiment an outsized role in the conflict, routinely accusing it of human rights abuses.

On March 7, Russia's ambassador to the United Nations blamed the Azov regiment for blocking an evacuation corridor in the besieged port city, saying they were using "citizens as a human shield." That claim has been repeated consistently in Russian media.

The same day, Azov major Denis Prokopenko said in a video shared on the regiment's Twitter account that the "attempts to organize a safe corridor for the (relocation) of civilian people... failed because of several actions of the enemy (Russian forces) in the assembly area."

After the bombing of a Mariupol theater that was sheltering civilians and had "children" written in Russian on the ground on either side of the building, the Russian Defense Ministry accused "militants of the nationalist 'Azov' battalion" of carrying out the attack. ​

In the Russian disinformation playbook, the Azov movement is a tempting target -- one where fact and disinformation can be elided.

Kyiv citizens take part in military training for civilians conducted by Azov regiment veterans on February 6, 2022.
Kyiv citizens take part in military training for civilians conducted by Azov regiment veterans on February 6, 2022.
The existence of an identifiably Azov element within the Ukrainian armed forces -- and an effective element at that -- poses uncomfortable questions for the Ukrainian government and its Western allies, which continue to send arms to the country.

CNN has reached out to ​Ukraine's defense ministry for comment.

See more
In the not-too-distant past, Azov's leadership openly espoused ​White supremacist views and cultivated links with similarly minded groups and individuals in the West.

In 2010, Andriy Biletsky, now leader of the National Corps, the Azov movement's political wing, reportedly said his goal was to "lead the White races of the world in a final crusade."

They thought they would be safe in the theater. Then it was bombed
They thought they would be safe in the theater. Then it was bombed
In a statement to CNN, the Azov regiment said it "appreciates and respects Andriy Biletsky as the regiment's founder and first commander, but we have nothing to do with his political activities and the National Corps party" -- adding the former commander never made such comments.

The statement said that Azov's "motivation has always angered Russia. Therefore, disinformation attacks on the AZOV Regiment have not stopped since 2014."

It added that the movement has "repeatedly denied allegations of fascism, nazism and racism," and have Ukrainians of all different backgrounds including "Greeks, Jews, Crimean Tatars, Russians" who "continue to serve in AZOV."

"Most of them are Russian-speaking, most are Orthodox. But there are Catholics and Protestants, Pagans and those who profess Islam and Judaism, and there are atheists," Azov asserted.

It noted that the Azov regiment's role is as "a special unit of the National Guard of Ukraine, and is subordinated exclusively to the Supreme Commander-in-Chief -- the President of Ukraine, by the way, a Jew."

"It would be absurd to think that we are united by the idea of white racism or nazism," the Azov statement added.

Despite the Azov movement's international notoriety, Ukraine "is not a cesspit for Nazi sympathizers," according to Alexander Ritzmann, a senior adviser at the Counter Extremism Project (CEP), based in Berlin.

He noted that in the last elections in Ukraine in 2019, Azov's political wing only won 2.15% of the vote, and Biletsky lost his seat in parliament.

Plus -- Ritzmann says -- there are far-right actors prominent in Russia, too. "There is a far-right extremist problem on both sides in the conflict, but there seems to be a bias in only reporting on Ukraine's far-right problem," he said.

Azov's beginnings

The Azov Battalion was formed in 2014, the same year Russian-backed rebels began seizing territory across Ukraine's eastern Donbas region, and Russia invaded and captured Crimea. At the time, Ukraine's Ministry of Defense encouraged volunteer battalions to join the resistance campaign and help its struggling army.

The battalion's role in recapturing Mariupol in June 2014 from Russian-backed forces brought it "hero status" in Ukraine, said Ritzmann.

But that status came with baggage -- the far-right views of some members and neo-Nazi insignia. These included the black sun, "a pagan symbol appropriated by Nazis for their pseudo-religion," and the Wolfsangel, "a symbol that far-right extremists have also adopted," Ritzmann said.

Andriy Biletsky, the leader of the National Corps political party, reportedly said his goal was to "lead the White races of the world in a final crusade."
Andriy Biletsky, the leader of the National Corps political party, reportedly said his goal was to "lead the White races of the world in a final crusade."
Azov's leaders have denied the neo-Nazi associations, saying the Wolfsangel "N" and "I' mean "national idea."

Even though the Azov Battalion was co-founded by Biletsky, who previously led the radical right group Patriot of Ukraine, the group was armed by the state and partly funded by local oligarchs in eastern Ukraine. That funding included money from the Jewish tycoon Ihor Kolomoisky, Ritzmann said. The US State Department sanctioned Kolomoisky in March 2021. The previous year, the US Justice Department placed him under investigation on accusations of embezzlement and fraud. ​

CNN has reached out to Kolomoisky's lawyer for comment.

In 2016, the United National High Commissioner of Human Rights accused armed groups on both sides of the Donbas conflict, including Azov, of human rights abuses.

International outreach

When the Azov Battalion was brought under the command of the Ministry of Internal Affairs as a regiment in 2014, "politically motivated fighters like (Andriy) Biletsky left and founded the Azov movement so they can do their ultra-nationalist, far-right work, which they were not allowed to do in the Ukrainian military," Ritzmann said.

The political party Biletsky formed, the National Corps, which the US Department of State described in 2018 as a nationalist hate group, "is essentially the spine of what we today call the Azov movement," Kacper Rekawek, a research fellow with the Center for Research on Extremism (C-REX) at the University of Oslo, told CNN.

"The Azov movement is a dangerous key player of the transnational extreme-right and has served as a network hub for several years now, with strong ties to far-right extremists in many European Union countries and the United States," Ritzmann said.

Nationalist activists light flares and shout anti-Russian slogans during a demonstration in front of President Volodymyr Zelensky's offices in Kyiv on October 14, 2020.
Nationalist activists light flares and shout anti-Russian slogans during a demonstration in front of President Volodymyr Zelensky's offices in Kyiv on October 14, 2020.
Olena Semenyaka, the head of the National Corps' international department, attended a festival in 2018 organized by German neo-Nazis; and in 2019 she spoke at the far-right Scanza Forum in Sweden alongside British neo-Nazi Mark Collett.

Since forming in 2014, the ​Azov movement has grown to include a militia, summer camps for kids and paramilitary training centers. It runs activities, including music festivals, political events and mixed-martial-arts tournaments, as it promoted itself in the international far-right space.

The National Corps has repeatedly demonstrated its disdain for liberal values in its treatment of minority groups -- with few repercussions.

A 2018 US State Department report found that the movement's militia "attacked and destroyed a Romani camp in Kyiv after its residents failed to respond to their ultimatum to leave the area within 24 hours," in full view of the local police.

The 'Death Star'

While the far-right worldview of the Azov movement is clear, there has been an intense debate on whether the Azov Battalion should be classed a "foreign terrorist organization" by the US Department of State.

"People always assume it (the Azov regiment and Azov movement) is one Death Star," Rekawek said. "Year by year, the connections (between the regiment and the movement) are looser," he said, explaining that the battalion's ranks now include Ukrainians who have no affinity with its neo-Nazi past.

Ritzmann says the far-right element in Ukraine's army is no different to what's been detected in other militaries, such as in Germany and the US.

"Presumably, far-right extremists serve in the Ukrainian military as they do in all other militaries -- valid data regarding the exact numbers are not available," he said.

'It is not just Ukraine we are protecting'
'It is not just Ukraine we are protecting'
"Back in 2015, the Azov Regiment itself claimed to have between 10% and 20% far-right extremists in their ranks," but those figures are possibly smaller today, he said.

But the regiment still uses the Wolfsangel symbol, and leaders of the Azov movement, who used to be commanders in the unit, continue to visit it, said Oleksiy Kuzmenko, a Ukrainian-American investigative journalist focusing on the Ukrainian far-right.

"The current leader of the Azov Regiment, Denis 'Redis' Prokopenko, is part of the core of the Azov movement since 2014, and served under commanders who went on to lead the Azov movement political and street wings," Kuzmenko told CNN.

Prokopenko's deputy, Svyatoslav "Kalyna" Palamar, has explicitly praised the movement's founder, Biletsky, as "a leader who 'finds sponsors that really invest money' into the regiment," Kuzmenko said.

In this photo taken outside Kyiv on July 14, 2017, a student at a paramilitary camp for children calls the rank to attention.
In this photo taken outside Kyiv on July 14, 2017, a student at a paramilitary camp for children calls the rank to attention.
Kuzmenko points out that as of 2021, the regiment was "actively involved in the training of the movement's youth leaders," and its website has a link to the movement's YouTube channel.

"Ukraine and (the) West's inaction on these issues paved the way for Putin to quite literally weaponize them against Ukraine in an attempt to justify his aggression," Kuzmenko said.

"While it's correct to point (out that) Ukraine's far-right has minimal electoral support, they (Azov) have enjoyed near impunity for violence aimed at minorities, were unchecked in their efforts to build influence in military and security forces, and have been normalized by Ukraine's senior leaders," he said.

In a statement to CNN on Wednesday, Prokopenko said: "Whoever calls us Nazis is deeply mistaken. We have young brave soldiers who give their lives for the independence of Ukraine and throw themselves under enemy tanks."

Foreign fighters

Since it formed, the Azov movement has recruited foreign fighters motivated by White supremacism to fight in Ukraine, experts say. Russia's full-scale invasion of the country, and Zelensky's call for foreign volunteers to join the fight, have raised concerns about radicalization in the war.

"My concern is that people, especially far-right extremists in Europe, (will gain) combat experience and training in the Ukrainian theater and then use that for terrorist attacks in Europe proper," Colin P. Clarke, senior research fellow at the New York- based ​foreign policy research nonprofit the Soufan Center, told CNN.

Valentyna Konstantynovska, aged 79, holds a weapon during basic combat training for civilians organized by the Azov regiment on February 13, 2022.
Valentyna Konstantynovska, aged 79, holds a weapon during basic combat training for civilians organized by the Azov regiment on February 13, 2022.
In 2020, Buzzfeed reported that Ukraine deported two members from the US-based neo-Nazi group the Atomwaffen Division, who were trying to gain combat experience with Azov.

Rekawek, an expert on foreign fighters at C-REX, said Azov has only been able to recruit 20 foreign fighters since the start of the 2022 invasion. CNN has not been able to verify those figures independently.

For its part, Russia also has a thriving ultra-nationalist scene that is tolerated by the authorities.

The Russian Imperial Movement (RIM), an extreme-right militia based in St. Petersburg, ​was, in 2020, the first White supremacist group to be categorized as "Specially Designated Global Terrorists" by the US State Department. While the RIM has worked in opposition to Putin's regime, it has supported the Russian side in the war against Ukraine -- training Russian militants to join pro-Russian separatists in the conflict, according to the Center for International Security and Cooperation (CISAC) at Stanford University.

Russian President Vladimir Putin meets with French Front National party leader Marine Le Pen at the Kremlin in Moscow on March 24, 2017.
Russian President Vladimir Putin meets with French Front National party leader Marine Le Pen at the Kremlin in Moscow on March 24, 2017.
"They have never confronted their own nationalists," said Rekawek. ​Experts say Russia has also been a player in Europe's far-right space, with France's Marine Le Pen and Italy's Matteo Salvini enjoying close links with Putin before the 2022 invasion.

And of the "few hundred western individuals with extreme right-wing or 'nationalist' convictions" who traveled to fight in the Ukraine conflict around 2014, "most of those extremist volunteers fought on the side of the pro-Russian separatists," according to a CEP report published in March.

Ritzmann has found pro-Russian groups calling for volunteers in his research. This includes "the Russian security contractor Wagner Group, which has a history of displaying Nazi insignia," he said in the CEP report.

But amid the tide of millions of refugees and untold damage to Ukrainian cities, some experts say Russia's fixation on a minor player like the Azov movement serves a purpose -- allowing the Kremlin to frame the conflict as an ideological and even existential struggle. However remote from reality that may be.

This story has been updated to include a statement from the Azov regiment.

https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2022/03/29/europe/ukraine-azov-movement-far-right-intl-cmd
Posted By: northlima dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/19/24 11:06 PM
Huge blast just hit pro Iran PMF base south of Baghdad about 40 min ago.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/24/24 05:57 PM
Gaza could surpass famine thresholds in six weeks, WFP official says

GENEVA, April 24 (Reuters) - The Gaza Strip could surpass famine thresholds of food insecurity, malnutrition and mortality in six weeks, an official from the World Food Programme said on Wednesday.
"We are getting closer by the day to a famine situation," said Gian Caro Cirri, Geneva director of the World Food Programme (WFP).

"There is reasonable evidence that all three famine thresholds -- food insecurity, malnutrition and mortality -- will be passed in the next six weeks."

A U.N.-backed report published in March said that famine was imminent and likely to occur by May in northern Gaza and could spread across the enclave by July. On Tuesday, a U.S. official said the risk of famine in Gaza, especially in the north, was very high.

Cirri was speaking at the launch of a report by the Global Network Against Food Crises, an alliance of humanitarian and development actors including United Nations agencies, the World Bank, the European Union and the United States.

In its report, the network described the 2024 outlook for the Middle East and Africa as extremely concerning due to the Gaza war and restricted humanitarian access, as well as the risk of the conflict spreading elsewhere in the region.

"As for Gaza, the conflict makes it difficult and sometimes impossible to reach affected people," Cirri said.

"We need to scale up massively our assistance... But under the current conditions, I'm afraid the situation will further deteriorate."

The United Nations has long complained of obstacles to getting aid in and distributing it throughout Gaza in the six months since Israel began an aerial and ground offensive against Gaza's ruling Islamist militant group Hamas.

Israel has denied hindering supplies of humanitarian aid and blames aid agencies for inefficiencies in distribution.

Israel's military campaign has reduced much of the territory of 2.3 million people to a wasteland with a humanitarian disaster unfolding since Oct. 7, when Hamas ignited war by storming into southern Israel.

Cirri said that the only way to steer clear of famine in Gaza was to ensure immediate and daily deliveries of food supplies.

"They've been selling off their belongings to buy food. They are most of the time destitute," he said.

"And clearly some of them are dying of hunger."

https://www.reuters.com/world/middl...-six-weeks-wfp-official-says-2024-04-24/

So Israel, the nation that controls everything that goes in and out of the territory is blaming others because the aid isn't getting in as we watch aid trucks backed up at the border not being allowed entry. Over 95 aid workers have been killed by indiscriminate bombing and the the latest WCK workers directly targeted. Hmmmmm, something doesn't add up there.
Posted By: MemphisBrownie Re: Israel at war again. - 04/25/24 02:30 PM



Clowns and sheep.
Posted By: FATE Re: Israel at war again. - 04/25/24 02:39 PM
"I wish I was more educated."

CANNOT make this stuff up.
Posted By: MemphisBrownie Re: Israel at war again. - 04/25/24 03:01 PM
The mask adds a certain touch of irony as well.
Posted By: dawglover05 Re: Israel at war again. - 04/25/24 03:03 PM
They collectively look really dumb. Not that I was the smartest of human beings between the ages of 18 and 22, but it's a demonstration that zeal without knowledge and reason is a very dangerous thing.

Academia has long been struggling with that dynamic and needs to get INFORMED professors from multiple angles. I don't think there is any other way that is better. Right now, looking at it from a bird's eye view, academia struggles with "champagne socialism" and it bleeds down to the students. The problem is that academia also lives very much in the conceptual vs the reality. That is why you see all the memes out there along the lines of "Well, I know how to explain the cave metaphor in Plato's Republic, but I don't know how to do my taxes." That is another thing that has to be fixed.

From my own viewpoint in law school, we had quite a few professors that had only ever known academia, and I obviously learned from them. Then, when I actually joined a firm, there were multiple occasions where certain partners would be like "Yeah, that's BS. This is how it really works."

Drawing back to the incident at hand here, it seems a lot of the protestors demonstrate rage for the sake of rage, rather than a legitimate cause. The problem therein is that there are definitely substantiated qualms against Israel's conduct in the war, but these protests are harmful in a backfiring kind of way.
Posted By: Bull_Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/25/24 03:35 PM
Originally Posted by dawglover05
Drawing back to the incident at hand here, it seems a lot of the protestors demonstrate rage for the sake of rage, rather than a legitimate cause. The problem therein is that there are definitely substantiated qualms against Israel's conduct in the war, but these protests are harmful in a backfiring kind of way.

Someone could probably make a lot of money if they marketed a practical protest curriculum. Then again, the powers that be would probably be against such a thing. Teaching people to protest effectively within the bounds of the law would be useful to society at large. It would be less ideal for the "elite," though.

I do agree that "unbridled" rage is problematic. It'd be great if we could somehow reach a paradigm of "positive" protest. I.e, instead of being largely disruptive and "combative," we could reach visible and constructive/active.

Anger as an impetus is fine. Anger as a "lifestyle"/"ongoing choice" is unhealthy and likely not particularly productive.

Just some quick thoughts and not a carefully formulated platform.
Posted By: dawglover05 Re: Israel at war again. - 04/25/24 03:40 PM
I agree. I don't think anybody did it better than the Civil Rights activists in the 50's and 60's. Whatever is going on right now ain't going to help anything.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/25/24 03:49 PM
Originally Posted by dawglover05
They collectively look really dumb. Not that I was the smartest of human beings between the ages of 18 and 22

And that pretty much covers it....

Headline

Young people sometimes do and say stupid things.

Details at 11:00
Posted By: MemphisBrownie Re: Israel at war again. - 04/25/24 04:18 PM
Quote
Someone could probably make a lot of money if they marketed a practical protest curriculum.

How to Make Your Protest 93% Peaceful: A Guide
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 04/25/24 06:46 PM
Originally Posted by MemphisBrownie
Quote
Someone could probably make a lot of money if they marketed a practical protest curriculum.

How to Make Your Protest 93% Peaceful: A Guide


Yeah we’ll throw money at just about anything but education these days.
Posted By: Bull_Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/25/24 09:33 PM
Originally Posted by PerfectSpiral
Originally Posted by MemphisBrownie
Quote
Someone could probably make a lot of money if they marketed a practical protest curriculum.

How to Make Your Protest 93% Peaceful: A Guide


Yeah we’ll throw money at just about anything but education these days.

Hmmmmmm.... college loan forgiveness seems a lot like throwing money at "education."

We throw money at education in the (dictionary) "the process of giving systematic instruction" sense. Unfortunately, that systematic instruction is of variable value.

How "enlightening" that education actually is/was is definitely debatable.
Posted By: superbowldogg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 01:03 AM
These protests are turning into the potential for Jews to be prosecuted for the 2nd time in the last 80 years.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-new...aders-warn-safety-palestinian-rcna148733
Posted By: EveDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 01:06 AM
Libtards are anti-semetic nazis.
Posted By: FATE Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 01:15 AM
It's so far out of hand. One of the most disgusting things I've seen in my life -- at least in my country.
Posted By: jfanent Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 01:37 AM
Some of these idiots don't even know what they're protesting.

Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 01:43 PM
That’s because most didn’t get a proper education in public Schools. I’ll repeat, we’ll throw money at just about everything but education.
Posted By: Bull_Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 02:30 PM
Originally Posted by PerfectSpiral
That’s because most didn’t get a proper education in public Schools. I’ll repeat, we’ll throw money at just about everything but education.

Your idea of education, sure. The ones able to throw the money's idea of education is working just fine for them. The system is creating exploitable "drones"/"cheap" labor just fine as they designed it.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 02:36 PM
Originally Posted by Bull_Dawg
Originally Posted by PerfectSpiral
That’s because most didn’t get a proper education in public Schools. I’ll repeat, we’ll throw money at just about everything but education.

Your idea of education, sure. The ones able to throw the money's idea of education is working just fine for them. The system is creating exploitable "drones"/"cheap" labor just fine as they designed it.

You’re going to need to show me a few examples of the ones throwing money at public schools. Otherwise BS as usual.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 02:42 PM
Here we go. This pier is going to be a bulls eye of violent killing.



Mortar attack on Gaza coast spotlights risk to U.S. pier mission
Assembly of the floating structure has begun miles offshore, and aid delivery is expected to start within days, officials said

Militants launched mortars at Israeli forces in Gaza as they prepared for the arrival of a floating U.S. Army pier dispatched to facilitate delivery of humanitarian aid, U.S. officials said Thursday, an incident that underscores the mission’s vulnerabilities.
Sign up for Fact Checker, our weekly review of what's true, false or in-between in politics.

The attack on a “marshaling area” for the pier caused minimal damage, and occurred while U.S. ships involved in the operation remain a ways off shore, said Maj. Gen. Patrick Ryder, a Pentagon spokesman. The pier is under construction by U.S. troops — though “nowhere near mortar range,” he said — and expected to be put into service by early May.
President Biden announced the pier’s deployment during his State of the Union address in March. With rising alarm about starvation in the war zone, and little sign that Israeli officials would heed U.S. pleas to allow more food into Gaza, Biden pledged to open a “maritime corridor” via the Mediterranean Sea using a temporary floating pier and a steel causeway connecting it to the shore.
Posted By: dawglover05 Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 02:49 PM
Who would be attacking the pier, exactly, though? If Israel attacked it, it would cause immense damage to their own campaign which is already losing support internationally. If Hamas attacked it, they would be depriving their own citizens of resources, and also lose substantial international support and sympathy. That would also justify Israel to say "See who we are dealing with?" and then enable them to double down on their own questionable tactics.

What am I missing?
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 02:53 PM
My answer is, a dartboard has a bullseye. Everyone wants to hit it. Plus Americans are there.
Posted By: FATE Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 03:06 PM
Hmmm, could it be the same people who used (and are still using) their own people as human shields, stole food from aid trucks from the get, and even shot some of it's own citizens to discourage them from following IDF orders to evacuate? Every dead Gazan makes Israel look like they're on the same level as Hamas.

With that said -- these 'shots' serve two purposes -- one, "we are still in charge here"; two, to see if the media will actually frame this as some unknown terrorist group rather than Hamas. Believe it or not, they are.

JMO
Posted By: dawglover05 Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 03:16 PM
They are wholly despicable and sociopathic, don't get me wrong. But, I'll just say it's a whole different ball game if the pier gets attacked and especially if US troops get harmed. I'd feel very confident that even Iran is saying "Don't touch the pier to their puppets." I could be wrong.
Posted By: FATE Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 03:31 PM
Oh, I agree. I'm just pondering the who and why.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 06:40 PM
Originally Posted by EveDawg
Libtards are anti-semetic nazis.

Nobody is buying your BS that one party has the market cornered on antisemitism. I don't even think you believe it. If you actually do here is a reminder......

Posted By: EveDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 07:26 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Originally Posted by EveDawg
Libtards are anti-semetic nazis.

Nobody is buying your BS that one party has the market cornered on antisemitism. I don't even think you believe it. If you actually do here is a reminder......



Your whatabout doesnt change the fact that we have the ugly libtard display of anti-semitism on our News every day. And its not just the students, its the FACULTY and libtard CONGRESS PEOPLE. SHAME.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 07:59 PM
There is no whatabout. You directly pointed the finger in one direction which is a complete and total lie. And when shown the truth you are still in denial as per usual.
Posted By: EveDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 08:03 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
There is no whatabout. You directly pointed the finger in one direction which is a complete and total lie. And when shown the truth you are still in denial as per usual.

It is 100% a whatabout. But thats ok. We know you cant accept the truth. All you have is whatabouts and strawmen. Thats why you take the L on the daily. And now youre taking the L because you cant admit that libtards from the top to the bottom are displaying anti-semetic behaivor every day for months now. You people should be ashamed of yourselves.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 08:16 PM
The only one taking the L here is the one claiming antisemitism is only a problem with the liberals. Everyone knows that's a blatant lie. It's a two way street that has roots on both sides.

And "your side" has been displaying antisemitism for decades.

I'm not ashamed of myself because I'm not antisemitic. However if I was on here lying about only one political party having people who are antisemitic among them I may have a reason to be ashamed for being a liar.
Posted By: EveDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 08:23 PM
Youre the one lying by putting words in my mouth that I never said. You lie all the time constantly. Same for your whatabout.

This thread is about Israel and Gaza. I am discussing the extreme antisemitism on display from the libtards from the top to the bottom relating to this.


You on the other hand are barfing up whatabouts like a dog who eats vomit. And lying by putting words in my mouth. Squirm and take your L.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 08:33 PM
So are you trying to say that those people on the right who are antisemitic suddenly don't count and they're secretly rooting for Israel to win the war? I didn't think so.

And I'm discussing the extreme antisemitism that has been being displayed on the right. You just want to silence anyone from talking about that. It won't work.

You wish to discuss what the media is talking about and ignore everything else. I'm not going to allow you to do that. Now eat your word vomit and climb back into your cave. Your cauldron may boil over if you don't get in there and stir it.

Take tour L and be honest for a change of pace. Antisemitism is something that exists on both parties. Anyone who claims otherwise is a liar.
Posted By: EveDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 08:36 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
So are you trying to say that those people on the right who are antisemitic suddenly don't count and they're secretly rooting for Israel to win the war? I didn't think so.

And I'm discussing the extreme antisemitism that has been being displayed on the right. You just want to silence anyone from talking about that. It won't work.

You wish to discuss what the media is talking about and ignore everything else. I'm not going to allow you to do that. Now eat your word vomit and climb back into your cave. Your cauldron may boil over if you don't get in there and stir it.

Take tour L and be honest for a change of pace. Antisemitism is something that exists on both parties. Anyone who claims otherwise is a liar.

Squirm and take the L for yourself and all the antisemetic libtards out there. Your whatabouts are no good here, neither is your word vomit. Time for the last walk in the shelter. Your number is up.
Posted By: EveDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 08:39 PM
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-68894386.amp

USC cancels graduation ceremony due to violence from antisemetic libtards.
Posted By: EveDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 08:41 PM
https://www.foxnews.com/us/holocaus...el-mobs-columbia-nazis-german-university

Halocaust Remembrence Center compares antisemetic libtards to Nazis.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 08:42 PM
You know, the adults in the room have been having some pretty good conversations here as of late. Then all it takes is one petulant child to come along ruin it all. Thank you petulant child for doing the only thing you know how to do. Spew word vomit.
Posted By: EveDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 08:43 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
You know, the adults in the room have been having some pretty good conversations here as of late. Then all it takes is one petulant child to come along ruin it all. Thank you petulant child for doing the only thing you know how to do. Spew word vomit.


Cry some more tears. You were only happy because no one was pointing out the truth.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 08:50 PM
And you certainly will never be the one to be telling the truth.

You and OCD should join forces and call yourselves the "Lefty-Tighty and the Righty-Loosey Brigade". Extremists from opposite ends of the spectrum.

I know it's usually said "righty-tighty, lefty-loosey" but I just can't imagine that you're a tighty.
Posted By: EveDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 08:51 PM
Everything is loose when your pinky is tiny.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 08:52 PM
Get a grip PeeWee, and not that kind of grip! Eve, just pwns you by not engaging the way you want. I love it. She smacks that noggin and say’s here’s your sign. you can’t make this ish up. And keep my handle out your mouth.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 08:56 PM
Originally Posted by EveDawg
Everything is loose when your pinky is tiny.

I understand that is what you've had to use as an excuse to every guy you've ever dated.
Posted By: EveDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 08:57 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Originally Posted by EveDawg
Everything is loose when your pinky is tiny.

I understand that is what you've had to use as an excuse to every guy you've ever dated.


Nope. But I can tell you have (not) much to compensate for.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 09:00 PM
Originally Posted by OldColdDawg
Get a grip PeeWee, and not that kind of grip! Eve, just pwns you by not engaging the way you want. I love it. She smacks that noggin and say’s here’s your sign. you can’t make this ish up. And keep my handle out your mouth.

And the "Lefty-Tighty and the Righty-Loosey Brigade" is now compete! It's shows just how easily I can accomplish a mission when dealing with the easily manipulated. At least now we'll have the cra craiest of the board banded together as they should have been all along. rofl
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 09:02 PM
Originally Posted by EveDawg
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Originally Posted by EveDawg
Everything is loose when your pinky is tiny.

I understand that is what you've had to use as an excuse to every guy you've ever dated.


Nope. But I can tell you have (not) much to compensate for.

We all know how denial works. I've been married to the same woman for 13 years. She seems to be doing fine. And how long have you been married now? They keep running off looking for something better. Bless your heart.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 09:02 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Originally Posted by OldColdDawg
Get a grip PeeWee, and not that kind of grip! Eve, just pwns you by not engaging the way you want. I love it. She smacks that noggin and say’s here’s your sign. you can’t make this ish up. And keep my handle out your mouth.

And the "Lefty-Tighty and the Righty-Loosey Brigade" is now compete! It's shows just how easily I can accomplish a mission when dealing with the easily manipulated. At least now we'll have the cra craiest of the board banded together as they should have been all along. rofl

That is the absolute dumbest nickname I’ve ever seen anyone on DT make up. Please continue to call us that so others can truly see your mental disability.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 09:04 PM
Eve, we better stop picking on him, he’s sP3cIal.
Posted By: EveDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 09:06 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Originally Posted by EveDawg
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Originally Posted by EveDawg
Everything is loose when your pinky is tiny.

I understand that is what you've had to use as an excuse to every guy you've ever dated.


Nope. But I can tell you have (not) much to compensate for.

We all know how denial works. I've been married to the same woman for 13 years. She seems to be doing fine. And how long have you been married now? They keep running off looking for something better. Bless your heart.


Pretty certain your bed is dead ever since kids happened. If she is "fine" then you have problems and you dont even know it lmao
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 09:08 PM
GOaT dayuuum! Now I feel bad for PeeWee.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 09:09 PM
Originally Posted by OldColdDawg
GOaT dayuuum! Now I feel bad for PeeWee.

Your self pity is another sign of your far left ideology.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 09:11 PM
LMFAO, I know you are but what am I… PeeWee.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 09:11 PM
Originally Posted by EveDawg
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Originally Posted by EveDawg
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Originally Posted by EveDawg
Everything is loose when your pinky is tiny.

I understand that is what you've had to use as an excuse to every guy you've ever dated.


Nope. But I can tell you have (not) much to compensate for.

We all know how denial works. I've been married to the same woman for 13 years. She seems to be doing fine. And how long have you been married now? They keep running off looking for something better. Bless your heart.


Pretty certain your bed is dead ever since kids happened. If she is "fine" then you have problems and you dont even know it lmao

And how long have you been married for again? Maybe it's as much your nasty mouth as it is your loosey problem. Between the two of them it's no wonder you can't keep a man.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 09:12 PM
Originally Posted by OldColdDawg
LMFAO, I know you are but what am I… PeeWee.


How would you put it?

Weak sauce. rofl
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 09:13 PM
Yeah Eve, force marry somebody and trap them in a pitiful relationship OR YOUR NOT NORMAL like a centrist.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 09:14 PM
I’d put it that way if I was as un-original and pathetic as you. PeeWee.
Posted By: EveDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 09:15 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Originally Posted by EveDawg
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Originally Posted by EveDawg
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Originally Posted by EveDawg
Everything is loose when your pinky is tiny.

I understand that is what you've had to use as an excuse to every guy you've ever dated.


Nope. But I can tell you have (not) much to compensate for.

We all know how denial works. I've been married to the same woman for 13 years. She seems to be doing fine. And how long have you been married now? They keep running off looking for something better. Bless your heart.


Pretty certain your bed is dead ever since kids happened. If she is "fine" then you have problems and you dont even know it lmao

And howe long have you been married for again? Maybe it's as much your nasty mouth as it is your loosey problem. Between the two of them it's no wonder you can't keep a man.

I have never been married because I dont want to be married. I'm a successful business woman and my life is set. I could retire right now, but enjoy what I do so much. And the men ask to marry me, and I turn them down and they cant handle it. I tell them upfront I dont want to get married. They cant handle it. Tough luck dudes.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 09:19 PM
Originally Posted by OldColdDawg
Yeah Eve, force marry somebody and trap them in a pitiful relationship OR YOUR NOT NORMAL like a centrist.

Centrist. What people who common sense escapes them considers it a bad word.

Your wound up tighter than Charlie Brown's alarm clock and its hilarious!
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 09:22 PM
Originally Posted by EveDawg
I have never been married because I dont want to be married.

I'll stop right there because it's obvious that and everything that comes after that is BS. tsktsk
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 09:24 PM
Originally Posted by OldColdDawg
I’d put it that way if I was as un-original and pathetic as you. PeeWee.

So your claim is that "PeeWee" is original? rofl

You're really not very good at this.
Posted By: EveDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 09:25 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Originally Posted by EveDawg
I have never been married because I dont want to be married.

I'll stop right there because it's obvious that and everything that comes after that is BS. tsktsk

Or you cant handle the truth. (like usual) There are growing numbers of women who dont want to be married. I dont need a contract to be in a relationship. No man gets to lock me down like that. I'm not a redneck who cant survive without a spouse.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 09:25 PM
That might be funny if I had a clue about what the hell you’re trying to say. I haven’t watched cartoons since I was a kid, and have zero respect for any dullard trying to reference them in a dis. Centrist Trump is similar to the real deal when the name calling starts. you can’t make this ish up. Comedy gold.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 09:27 PM
You would first have to figure out what the truth is before you can pretend you know what it means for someone else not to understand it. So only redneck women get married? You can't help but to keep stepping in it can you?
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 09:28 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Originally Posted by EveDawg
I have never been married because I dont want to be married.

I'll stop right there because it's obvious that and everything that comes after that is BS. tsktsk

As if you have a clue! rofl I respect what she said, she’s not afraid to stand on her own two feet. But it’s not the centrist way… You’re just lucky that your Mrs. Can’t see or smell that well…All I’ll say about that.
Posted By: EveDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 09:29 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
You would first have to figure out what the truth is before you can pretend you know what it means for someone else not to understand it. So only redneck women get married? You can't help but to keep stepping in it can you?


Word salad much? Try making sense Kamala.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 09:33 PM
Originally Posted by OldColdDawg
That might be funny if I had a clue about what the hell you’re trying to say. I haven’t watched cartoons since I was a kid

Hmmm, then why would you think that's what I'm referring to? It seems as though, from your own words yet again, you know exactly what I'm trying to say. tsktsk

Quote
and have zero respect for any dullard trying to reference them in a dis.

You mean reference it like you are doing?

Quote
Centrist Trump is similar to the real deal when the name calling starts.

Another term of what you claim to be your genius originality? naughtydevil

Quote
you can’t make this ish up. Comedy gold.

And yet here you are still making it up. #weaksauce
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 09:33 PM
Originally Posted by EveDawg
Word salad much? Try making sense Kamala.

Okay MTG.
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 09:35 PM
You said Charlie Brown… Cartoon… Here’s Your Sign.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 09:38 PM
Says the man who has been using Pee Wee all day pretending he had no idea what it was in reference to. #weaksauce
Posted By: OldColdDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 09:41 PM
It’s me saying you are like PeeWee Herman with your childish comebacks from elementary school. That must have been when you stopped developing mentally. Typical centrist.
Posted By: EveDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/26/24 10:59 PM


Jewish student schools antisemetic UCLA professor.
Posted By: EveDawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/27/24 02:14 AM
https://www.dailywire.com/news/terr...ring-aid-to-gaza-hamas-vows-to-stop-pier

Hamas tries to stop aid from getting in.
Posted By: dawglover05 Re: Israel at war again. - 04/27/24 02:24 PM
Welp, there you have it I guess. Makes zero sense. Bunch of freaking a holes and morons to boot.
Posted By: PerfectSpiral Re: Israel at war again. - 04/27/24 02:36 PM
Originally Posted by EveDawg

This has been going on all along. Just saying.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/27/24 02:42 PM
Originally Posted by OldColdDawg
It’s me saying you are like PeeWee Herman with your childish comebacks from elementary school. That must have been when you stopped developing mentally. Typical centrist.

Okay Beavis.

Let me explain how being a moderate works.

An extremist can become anorexic because they are so obsessed with not getting fat to the point they die.

Or an extremist may gorge themselves on food because they just can't stop eating and become 400 lbs.

But a moderate eats, enjoys their food but limits their intake to maintain a healthy weight.

So yes, I'm proud to be a moderate.

You think anyone who isn't an extremist has something wrong with them. You just keep drinking that Kool-Aid.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/27/24 02:43 PM
Originally Posted by PerfectSpiral
Originally Posted by EveDawg

This has been going on all along. Just saying.

Yet it's Israel that's been blocking aid from crossing the border into Gaza.
Posted By: Bull_Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/27/24 02:53 PM
...I'm not sure that being bipolar and being a moderate are really the same thing. poke
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/27/24 02:56 PM
That's just a cross you'll have to bear. #thoughtsandprayers
Posted By: Bull_Dawg Re: Israel at war again. - 04/27/24 03:57 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
That's just a cross you'll have to bear. #thoughtsandprayers

Yeah, I'll take half. lol

Might crimp the toes a bit, but the shoe might fit me somewhat, too.
Posted By: PitDAWG Re: Israel at war again. - 04/27/24 04:05 PM
I'm one who responds in kind. If someone wishes to engage in an actual discussion I'm more than happy to. If someone wants to sling $#!+ I'm also happy to respond in kind. What you have decided to describe as bipolar is simply having the ability to adapt to the situation. But everyone has the right to their own perspective.
Posted By: Damanshot Re: Israel at war again. - 04/27/24 07:27 PM
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Originally Posted by OldColdDawg
It’s me saying you are like PeeWee Herman with your childish comebacks from elementary school. That must have been when you stopped developing mentally. Typical centrist.

Okay Beavis.

Let me explain how being a moderate works.

An extremist can become anorexic because they are so obsessed with not getting fat to the point they die.

Or an extremist may gorge themselves on food because they just can't stop eating and become 400 lbs.

But a moderate eats, enjoys their food but limits their intake to maintain a healthy weight.

So yes, I'm proud to be a moderate.

You think anyone who isn't an extremist has something wrong with them. You just keep drinking that Kool-Aid.


You might also want to point out that a moderate can usually see both sides and try to work for a solution that helps the most people. Not everyone.. Because that's gotta be impossible. But the most people.
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