http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/201...s-and-osweiler/

Could be the reason he never succeeds. Stay tuned...

That's pretty crazy if it's true.

From what I've read online, just general commenting, nothing official.

O'Brian is a hot head.

Brady and Hoyer nicknamed him "teapot" because eventually he'd go off.

Brock however does appear to be slightly mentally frahgeelay.

Dude complained about being benched for Peyton fricken Manning. (Regardless of how much Manning sucked that year, he's still PM.)

Here's another article about it ... dude sounds like a real buet ... but who cares ... he was what we had to eat along with 16 mill for a 2nd rnd pick ... I'm guessing he won't be long with us ... we'll see ....

I'd call him an unexpected, BENIFICIAL, interesting domino ... *L* ...

Brock Osweiler - QB - Browns
According to Pro Football Talk's Mike Florio, the Texans decided to move on from Brock Osweiler following a halftime altercation with coach Bill O'Brien in Week 17.
Osweiler's tiff with O'Brien had been mentioned in passing, but apparently it was the deciding factor in Houston's decision to find a new quarterback. Tom Savage started against the Titans in Week 17 but was ruled out in the second quarter after suffering a concussion. Osweiler lashed out at O'Brien after he was told that he'd be finishing the game, ripping O'Brien for using him only because he had to. As the conflict escalated, Osweiler accused O'Brien of holding him hostage after O'Brien blocked him from walking away. Eventually the two had to be separated. It's common for stories to leak out like this after a messy divorce, but clearly Osweiler was never right for Houston.
Related: Texans
Source: Pro Football Talk on NBC Sports Mar 12 - 12:53 PM

Was Osweiler taken before O'Brien was hired? Apologies if I am absolutely mis-recalling. I also think BO felt the pressure of that gargantuan contract - no-one wants to fail, and he probably felt immense pressure to live up to the contract. If he was acquired before O'Brien, then that makes it a FO mess-up pure and simple. I'm hoping we give him a chance, Hue has proven he's good with QBs.

At the very least he could be a decent qb for us, that "bridge" qb we talk about until we can get the guy for the future hopefully next year.

We've been building bridges for so long that we sound more like a government contractor than an NFL team.

Maybe we should hire some engineers in our FO.

No .. they signed BO last year ... O'Brien was there but wanted nothing to do with him ... the GM wanted him ... the GM won short term ... O'Brien just won long term ... *LOL* ..

Problem is Pit ,... there's never anyone on the other side of the bridge ... our bridge leads to more failure ... *L* ...

It reminds me of Alaska and "The bridge to nowhere".

Some people just come off as d-bags, and Brock is one of them. I can easily see how he and a coach (especially one like O'Brien) would butt heads

Cheers Diam, that's what I thought I read. The situation then makes complete sense on how it unfolded from a Houston perspective.

I'd kick the tires on him just to see who the real QB is. Denver or Houston. I think he would hard to prove he was not a fluke. If he doesn't then we cut him and no harm and no foul.

I don't see the point in keeping the guy unless they don't get another QB.

They like Kessler and Hogan. I believe they like them more than Osweiler.

He doesn't read the field. He has a long delivery. He is inconsistent with accuracy for many reasons.

I don't see him on the roster.

Yeah it's definitely true. There's even footage from Savage's tantrum.

Report: Browns unwilling to give up two first-rounders or No. 1 overall for Garoppolo

From Cleveland.com:

The Browns will still make a run at Patriots backup quarterback Jimmy Garoppolo, league sources say, and they might use this 2018 second-rounder, or one of their other two second-rounders next year, as a part of a package to try to get the Patriots to part with their backup.

http://www.csnne.com/new-england-patriot...jimmy-garoppolo

Good. That's a ridiculous price tag.

Beat me too it Memphis ...+1

There have been rumors of Osweiler being a bad teammate since his time in Denver. That, on top of him being a horrible QB, is the reason he won't ever play for us.

We've obviously leaked that we are trying to trade him (and if we aren't able to trade him, cut him). Do you think we would have done that if Hue Jackson thought there was even a small chance of him working out?

Hmmmm.......Given our decisions at the QB position....wouldn't him being a horrible QB be a reason why he might play for us?

Sorry, I couldn't help it.

Rumors don't mean anything. He knew how to play well enough that a Hall of Fame QB wanted to sign him long term. That means something. It's always possible O'brian can't run an offense to save his life.

He is payed for so you might as well kick the tires at least until someone will get desperate and be willing to trade for him. Maybe Hue can figure out how to make him look good. WHO KNOWS! I sure don't. I do know if he can't get along with Hue though he has no future beyond it.

This is not true. They create a perception about a player (rightly or wrongly).

I am sure our front office/coaches have looked into the rumors and determined whether they are valid or not.



Elway could also have been making a huge mistake. In hindsight, it looks like he dodged a bullet.

Thank God, that is a major relief if there ever was one.

Actually the Browns never have said they would cut him. He is on the trade block. No doubt. At this time he is an asset they are using to get more assets.

But, if there is no trading partner they will not cut him until after the 2017 season unless they come up with 2 QB's they feel are better than Brock.

At this moment in time he is the best QB in the club house. That made the decision to release RG3 easier. Unless at least one of these 3 things happen he will be on the roster in 2017 and maybe as the starter.

1) Trade for Jimmy Garrapolo.

2) Trade for Kirk Cousins.

3) Trade up from #12 to get either Trubisky or Watson.

4) Trubisky or Watson falls to #12.

It is possible that none of the following falls into place for the Browns and Osweiler starts next season.

We haven't really said anything about him officially.



https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/839951319431589889

Please read this article written by Terry Pluto. He has been one of the best most in the know beat writers of the Browns since the 1970's.
http://www.cleveland.com/pluto/index.ssf/2017/03/cleveland_browns_have_terry_ta_106.html

Also, why would we cut a QB with a career winning record 13-8 for Kessler who is 0-8. Not saying he won't improve but he is yet to win a game in his career.

You are assuming that a QB's record has something to with his play. What would Kessler's record be if he played with the best defense in the league?

I'll answer that. 6-10 tops, in a career year where everything went right. His lack of arm strength is obvious, and a major issue. Has other good traits, but a weak arm is death in the NFL.

Cody is not the answer. The sooner the Browns realize that, the better.

Actually, I think they already know it, even if some of our fans don't.

So two wins less than Osweiler.

I don't think Kessler is the answer to any starting quarterback question, but judging a QB by his record tells me next to nothing about their performance.

I have a poor opinion of what Cody could throw from his college tape. I said as much when we drafted him.

I think that my opinion got even worse watching what he refused to throw this last year.

All that being said, I think that Cody can become a decent QB if given a lot of time to develop.

I don't think that he'll ever be that franchise QB, but I think he could be become a good game manager or back-up.

This year things should slow down for him a bit and he'll be more used to the offense. If coaches can work on his release we should see some positive results.

What I don't like is that he is going to have to learn under fire unless we somehow manage to bring in a veteran.

"It is possible that none of the following falls into place for the Browns and Osweiler starts next season. "
=======================================================

Hue has made it very clear that his mission is to secure a quarterback. It will not Osweiler.

Osweiler being the the last guy standing would be shocking to me.

I'm assuming that's the case until we have a better option in place.

Kessler is already a better option. just my opinion.

i'll admit i didn't see much of Houston last year, but based on all accounts, he was awful

Kessler also refuses to throw the ball down field, but at least he didn't turn it over and is a good teammate.

I would say he didn't refuse too throw deep, I would venture to say it's because he never had the time ... JMHO

Next time CK throws a 8 yard out on a 3rd and 15, I'll celebrate him not turning it over. Despite an incoming change of possession that's de facto his fault.

Cody will be a different QB next year ... some on here think he's INCAPABLE of IMPROVING ..

He will throw deep much more often this year than he did last year ...

The game was moving to fast for him last year .. if it doesn't slow down and he doesn't learn how to throw people open ... he will never even be the very good #2 I thought he could develop into when we drafted him ...

Folks are crapping all over (and he did STINK last year ) a kid that should have never even seen the field last year ... he should have been buried so far on our bench we shouldn't have even known he was there ...

He may never be ready to throw guys open and atrusts what he sees ... IF NOT ... BYE BYE CODY ... and even if he does a good back up is his cieling ...

But blaming last year on him and throwing him out with the bath water w/o giving him a chance is just silliness i tell ya ... silliness ...

He will be better .. the question is ... will he BE GOOD ENOUGH!!!

That is not true. You're just making things up again.

He can get better. After all, he was a rookie. But the guy has a poor arm and he knows it. That severely limits what an offense can do.

He can be a backup qb, but I don't see him as a viable starter in the NFL.

OK, first off, I want to let it be known that I'm just bringing this up for discussion's sake. From what I saw this year, I agree that Kessler has limitations on arm strength - though I don't think its as bad as many on here seem to think it is.

BUT, given that there's been some discussion around ball velocity at the combine, Kessler's ball came out at 55mph....which was very much middle of the pack.

I've always thought his short to mid-range stuff seems to come out at a decent velocity...it's his long range stuff that arcs like a freaking rainbow....

You Guys Are Always harping on Cody Kesslers weak arm, how about Brian Sipe everyone accused him of having a weak arm but he had a pretty successful career, and when he did go deep he wasn't to bad at it, if you go to www.deadspin.com you will see that QB's in the NFL only pass 20+ yards 9% to 16% of the time, most throws are short outs crossing patterns or dump offs (Swing or Screens) so although the deep ball is exciting it isn't the most used pass in the NFL ...

Its not about the bomb. It's the ability to hit the 20-25 yards passes on a rope that separates good QBs from limited QBs.

20+ yard passes are rare in the NFL ...

At least we would get improved field position!

I wanted to look into this a little deeper:

Last year Kessler averaged 3.86 Air Yards, Osweiler was at 3.50. Kessler averaged 7.1 yards per attempt, Osweiler 5.8 (Osweiler was 0.4 yards below anyone else in the league in this category, Kessler didn't qualify, but if he did he would have been middle of the pack).

Kessler did not throw downfield in 2016. Osweiler was incapable of throwing downfield in 2016 (and he had Deandre Hopkins).

and 20 yards is not a bomb ...

Brian Sipe was not afraid to throw any pass asked of him. Bizarre comparison. Heck, if anything, Sipe trusted his arm too much.

It's not just the bomb that I am talking about. It's the ability/willingness to throw the deeper intermediate routes and the deeper outs.

Heck, Hue has talked about the same thing. Are you going to wave that annoying finger in his face, too? Are you saying that you know more about qb play than Hue does? Seriously?

There is no doubt that teams started stacking the LOS to stop our running game, which was ranked as high as 4th in the league. They also challenged Kessler to beat them w/the throws I have already talked about. Kessler was unable to do so and the offense stagnated. Hue was obviously very frustrated by this.

Oh, and just for fun. Let me use the "logic" that you bring to the table when discussing Jimmy G.

Kessler stinks because he is a back-up qb.

You wanted facts here they are, and all you want to do is skirt the facts, and by the way Kessler has started 8 games half a season as a rookie so far that makes him a starter ...

What in the hell are you talking about now?

Skirt the facts? LMAO...

lol

That's truly interesting. Not sure where you go for your stats ... I'd be interested on the data on Wentz and Siemen.

AND before anyone tries to imply I am saying sats make Kessler a better QB prospect than Wentz. . . I am not.

I'm curious just how different Osweiller's numbers are for the previous year with Denver.

Just quoting for context Vers, not because I'm trying to directly counter your points.

I think its hard to say that Kessler was afraid to go deep so much as the deep routes simply weren't there for him much of the time either due to spotty WR play or the inability of the Oline to give him the time it took to let a longer route develop.

I never found Kessler unwilling to throw. What I saw a lot of was him flushed out of the pocket early and trying to put himself in a position to still pass downfield.

Here is the link to the site:

https://www.sportingcharts.com/nfl/stats/quarterback-air-yards/2016/

Wentz averaged 3.21 Air Yards per attempt (that is really low).

Siemian was at 4.01.

With the Broncos in 2016 Osweiler averaged 7.2 yards per attempt and 3.81 Air Yards Per attempt.

Thanks ! That link now saved to favorites!!

I have no idea why I wouldn't have looked before ... but given how much credit I put into PFF grades I finally had a look at the QB grades from last year!! Interesting reading. I value PFF as they grade each play according to whay happened as opposed to just looking at a stat line. If a WR makes a great play on what was otherwise a poorly thrown pass, the WR gets a lot of credit and the QB doesn't.... It's led to some interesting discussions for sure and not everyone is sold on PFF for sure.

Kessler - 74.2
Dak - 84.9
Wentz - 76.8
Tyrod Taylor - 84.6
Garoppolo - 74.7
Mariota - 72.4
Flacco - 71.4
Bortles - 52.9
RG3 - 52.1
Winston - 77.5

Boy oh boy, my news feed just blew up with something Bernie Kosar shared. Interesting times we live in for sure.

http://nypost.com/2017/03/12/texans-last-straw-brock-osweilers-eruption-at-having-to-play/

"There were two tantrums thrown by quarterbacks during the Texans’ Week 17 loss in Tennessee last season. The first resulted from a player being too woozy to play, the next from a player being asked to play.

The dust is settling on Brock Osweiler’s one-year Texans stint, and the team is kicking him on his way out. According to a Pro Football Talk report, that game against the Titans — not any of the previous weeks of horrific Osweiler play — was when Houston realized it needed to move on from its $72 million mistake..."

Sounds like he's going to love being in Cleveland. I think I'm just going to wait and see about this one.

This will be year two in the same system for kessler. I expect to see big improvements. One thing that should definately improve is chemistry between him and coleman. Hopefully our #1 WR learns how to get open this season. IF Kessler trusts him more then the deeper passes will also come.

It's fine to disagree. We just saw two completely different things.

Hopefully, we'll get a real qb and all this Kessler talk can be put to bed.

+1 on TP article, made sense to me...I know this, I heard Sashi state BO can come in and compete...that isn't cutting him/nor trading him....he has value, is on the team, He is WAY taller than Hue's 6'2" minimum, has won games AND is 26...I agree he's better NOW than RGIII- who is brittle and holds the ball....I don't care what we do with BO...hope he uses deodorant... smile...Go Browns!!!!

"TO smells like BO"

Sorry, this thread reminded me of the 2nd best sign I ever saw at a Browns game.

The first being "We still have LeBron"

LOL...........my daughter and I were at that game. We were laughing out behinds off at that sign.

I was at that game too. The best part was that you could tell it bothered TO because he tried to tear it down.

The "Jump Art" signs in the old muni were pretty funny. Somebody would always manage to get one on tv before they were ripped down.

LOL............yeah, that was great. Remember the fans leaning over the edge trying to hold onto the signs? LMAO........we were laughing like crazy.

Great memory............but, McNabb running all over the field wasn't so great. Oh well...........

Heard the Browns are offering Brock and a 5th for a 3rd. Source; a local sports talk show I listen to. We are doing this to accumulate more picks to package for JG according to the hosts.

I don't think we'll get that, but I hope we do.

Who would even be interested in him really?

I would swing hard for Cousins.

If WAS isn't that interested in keeping him, I'd offer Brock and maybe a 2nd+ for Kirk.

Washington needs to start over. So they could ride Brock to a high pick probably.

Sorry Pryor.

I can't say I have really watched, or even read much about Brock. What makes him so bad?

He played well in Denver. Well enough to get Houston to pony up a ton.

Is it possible he and O'Brien simply couldn't get along. Somewhere in the dozens of article that have gone up since we traded for him, one of them said O'Brien never wanted him. The GM did.

Could Brock have been put in the middle of a power struggle in Houston? Is it possible for a coach to place his QB in to a no win situation?

I think the Browns and media need to start treating this guy like he is a member of the team.

He's that bad .... it literally hurt watching him ...

Our QB's were bad ... they were down right HORRIBLE last year .... i do not believe we had one well played game from a QB last year ... we never had a complete 60 minutes as far as I can remember .... and a lot of that falls on them ... but there was ineptitude around them all year long also .. the WR's and TE's and OL and RB's chipped in at times ...

BO played with a VERY GOOD O that played far from inept around him ... he DESTROYED that O all by himself ... Lamar Miller, BO made Hopkins who is one of the top 5 WR's in football INVISIBLE ... and thats hard to do cause Hop has a SICK CATCH RADIUS ....

I'm not exxagerating when i list these shortcomings ... and there all pretty glaring ...

- innacurate ...
- holds ball to long, slow decisions ...
- long, slow delivery
- very awkward, does not move well at all in the pocket and he is un-atheletic ..

I'd much rather play Cody ...

I wouldn't say all by himself. Houston's OL is bad.

I agree. I don't know what will happen or what the plan is... and while I know it's a business and it can be ruthless, I'd like to see a little more class exuded by the team (and media).

I know that stats never tell the whole story, but I remember how mad Elway was when Brock took off for Houston. They wanted to retain him. Very badly.

I can't say I've ever watched him play in Houston. Did watch one game with him in Denver. The Denver Oline looked decent to the untrained eye anyway.

We've beefed up our Oline and I'm just wondering out loud, can that be the difference for him?

He is not going to be on the team.

Always hopeful.

I would keep him over Kessler and the kid from Stanford.

No thanks... I'll stick with Kessler.

Kessler was better last year on a worse team.

Stats always tell the complete story.

http://www.cantonrep.com/sports/20170312/browns-after-blockbuster-big-questions-about-little-oz

Kessler was terrible. He was part of the reason why they went 1-15. A back up QB at best. I would like him to be this teams 3rd string emergency QB at best next season.

And he was better than Osweiler.

Osweiler won a playoff game. Kessler has yet to win a pre season game.

Yes. Brock Osweiler won the playoff game against Connor Cook and the Raiders. The Texan's defense (and Derek Carr being hurt) had nothing to do with the victory.

A year prior he also beat the New England Patriots 30-24 when they came into the game 10 - 0. He led a touchdown drive with just over 1 minute remaining to tie the game and a touchdown drive in OT to win the game.

I am sorry Cody Kessler has a mind to play QB in the NFL but not the body. He cannot withstand the punishment and cannot throw deep. Reminds me of Ken Dorsey.

j/c

Os is not the answer, but neither is Kessler. I do expect Kessler to improve, but he either does not have the ability to throw deep, or the stones. I do not see more reps as the answer to that.

As someone said, if Kessler is our 3rd string/emergency QB, then OK. If he is the #1 or #2 QB, then we have issues at QB.

Right now, Os has the most ability of any QB on the roster. And if we bring in Geno Smith, then Os still has the most ability of any QB on the roster.

Why do we always have a QB with a "good football mind" and a QB with the physical tools, but never both in the same person..

Because when we find that person we will stop looking for a franchise QB.

From this article, Brockwieler after the playoff loss..

"Any time you don't end your season with a Super Bowl championship, you're going to be disappointed. And I'm certainly disappointed. It's easy to point out the negative from this year, but there were also a lot of great things that we can certainly build on in the future."

I have not watch any video of him saying this, but my initial reaction, was how boring that statement is.

Like, he had been think since the game ended what he should say.

Like, he doesn't actually care.

Maybe I'm reaching.

j/c:

I find it somewhat sad that we Brown's fans have a substantial discussion as to which of quarterbacks stinks less.

Trade for Jimmy G!

He's not up for trade or has something changed?

He's not up for trade....? What does that mean in English?

Exactly!

If the Pats would trade Jimmy G to us I would do that in a heartbeat. Besides that there are not really many intriguing QB solutions this year.

It is interesting that a team like the Denver Bronco's who feel they are a QB away and have interest in Brock. But, a QB starved team like the Browns want to trade him. What am I missing?

j/c...

1. There is nothing wrong with Competition - if he is here let him compete with Kessler for the starting job.

2. Everyone is comparing Kessler to BO is thinking about Kessler's performance as a Rookie vs. that of a 4-5 year Pro.

jmho

And your source is ??

That's why it is so hard to find a franchise QB. Hard to find both those qualities in one guy at the same time.

J/c

Brock Osweiler - QB - Browns

Browns coach Hue Jackson is preparing as if Brock Osweiler will be on the team this season.
"Obviously, he's a player on our team and we're going to treat him just like we do all of our other quarterbacks until he's not," said Jackson. It's classic coach-speak and really doesn't mean much of anything. Assuming the Patriots hold on to Jimmy Garoppolo, the Browns should select a quarterback early in the draft, possibly as soon as 12th overall. The Browns could shop Osweiler but releasing him is the more likely outcome. He's not long for Cleveland.

Source: NFL.com Mar 26 - 1:11 PM

"Obviously, he's a player on our team and we're going to treat him just like we do all of our other quarterbacks until he's not," said Jackson.

Sounds like what he said about RGIII right before he cut him ...

He sounds very excited to work with Osweiler.

Some quotes from Hue Jackson on Brock Osweiler (sorry if some have already been posted):



This does not seem like a glowing endorsement. I think it's similar to something they said about Griffin earlier the off-season.





Funny. I didn't read the whole article and then got to this:



http://www.news-herald.com/sports/201703...-in-and-compete

I'll believe Osweiler is a part of team's plans when I see him in uniform during the off-season.

I'd like to see him go to camp with us, just in case there is any salvage there. But I'm cool with whatever they do this year. We can go 1-15 again if we have to, so long as we get a QB this year or next and have solid players across the board by the end of next year.

After next year, not this upcoming season, I expect us to start being very competitive.

j/c...

When I say let him compete...I don't expect him on our roster come September.

2. I know some have said because Hue is a QB guru...he can make BO into a good QB. He's a QB guru...not a Saint who can perform miracles. Just a lot wrong with the kid and the first being he simply is not accurate.

3. Broncos miss out on Romo...I hope they will give up a 5/6th round pick for BO and we pay half his salary...Elway was hot on him February 2016.

I think that is the only team possible for the trade.

4. If we keep him here in camp...the first time he falls to the ground regardless how hard...he's going to get up with a strained back that will not heal for the entire season.

jmho

I think Osweiler burned some bridges when he left Denver. Osweiler was also not happy that he got benched for Manning.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/heres-how-the-texans-stole-brock-osweiler-from-the-broncos/

http://www.foxsports.com/nfl/story/brock-osweiler-denver-broncos-houston-texans-031016

On top of both of those things, the coaching staff that had him in Denver is gone.

I don't see any team trading for him at this point. Our best hope is that we release him and somebody else signs him and offsets some of his costs.

Control + F "Osweiler"

https://brickwallblitz.wordpress.com/2017/03/26/the-2016-17-deep-ball-project-part-23/

Don't you mean ctrl + F- ?

Anyone think we might deal Brock DURING the Draft?

Maybe a team is sitting there in the 3rd round, having missed out on all the QBs.

And we offer Broswiler and a 5th or 6th for the 3rd?

Just a thought.

That could happen, but it would be hard to do so and redo his deal so we would cover part of his deal at the same time. (because no one is going to take him at $16 million)

I think Brock will be on this team when the season starts unless we trade for Jimmy G. because it costs us nothing to keep him and Hue might feel he can fix him. Frankly, I think it worth checking it out to see if Hue can work with him. If he can't its no big loss to us since we already picked up a second rounder to experiment with him. If we land JG though Brock needs to go to avoid a cancerous locker room IMHO.

Another vote of confidence for Brock Osweiler, this time from Jimmy Haslam:



http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2017/03/jimmy_haslam_says_brock_osweil.html

And another from Hue Jackson:



http://www.ohio.com/blogs/cleveland-brow...etings-1.756727

Optimistic thought:
This process will humble Glock Osweiler and he will finally become Shea Serrano's fantasy.

j/c

Say what you will, you have to admire his footwork:

Link

Sounds like Hue cannot wait to get him in the building and start to mold that piece of clay!

During his interview on NFL Network I noticed a little smile come on his face when they mention Trubisky, watch the replay when it becomes available and see what you think ...

One thing I find very interesting is the almost utter dismissal of him in the media, while making moves that speak to likely starting (at least) camp with him on the roster. Brock has a history of conflict when he doesn't get his way, ticking off coaches and stirring it up on the sideline. The Browns' public disinterest and dismissal could be a way of letting him know that not only is he not special, he's going to have to work extremely hard just to have the opportunity to compete. That includes doing and saying all the right things between now and then. In other words, GYST, Brock, you got a long way to go.

Steve Smith:

https://twitter.com/SI_ExtraMustard/status/858068513050812418

Steve Smiith, a new a hole Raven who can comment on our team . John Elway offered Ossweiller a contract, he just took more with the Texans(bad move). Every time I hear an Ex Bunghole, Pukesburgh or Ratbird say negative crap I think they realize we are getting closer. It ain't long before we start putting it on them, we had a terrific draft.

Yeah, they've been talking trash about us forever. So they've been scared of us since 1999?

Yeah, we've sure shown them!

None of this changes the fact that Osweiler was one of the worst QBs in the history of the league last year.

Is he to be kept? I just feel nothing for the kid. Just not sure what we will do, especially with Hogan who is a man of mystery. We did supposedly shop hard during the draft or before for a veteran. Who is "to bring this group along"? Wait and see, I guess.

Good luck to all involved.

From what Mike Silver said in his article, Osweiler is number two on the depth chart behind Kessler. I don't think he makes it to week one (which is longer than I thought he would last when we first traded for him).

Barring injury to someone's QB, I doubt he's getting traded.

The question is whether or not we keep him around then.

I wonder how much his 2018 salary being gaurenteed for injury scares them.

Might as well keep him as a camp arm if we can't trade him. We're paying him regardless. Maybe someone's starter gets hurt in the preseason and a team gets desperate. I don't think I would carry him into the season, but he could surprise and look good in camp.

We should probably wait to evaluate the qb position. As much as some people don't like him, he is probably the best qb on the roster right now.

How's that for depressing?

Let Hue get a good look at him before we cut him. We need camp arms anyway.

I felt a sick feeling in my gut when I looked at my phone and saw we traded for BO. This was before I knew about the 2nd rd pick etc. etc. I also thought we had a really good chance of acquiring JG.

However, JG didn't materialize and BO is still on our team. I now try to remind myself that Elway once believed he was a suitable successor for Manning. Elway threw a lot of $$ his way just not as much as Houston. O'Brien's system didn't work well with BO and he had massive ego clashes and meltdowns. Lets hope he was humbled. Lets hope the guy Elway believed in shows up and Hue is able to get something out of him.

I look at it like this. The FO has made multiple attempts to find a franchise QB without putting all of their eggs in one basket.

Last year they kicked the tires of a past high draft pick. RG3. It did not work out and they cut their ties with him.

They did pass on Wentz but drafting him at #2 would be marrying their selves to the success of Wentz. He was too risky of a pick for them at that time.

They traded down a few times and stocked up on picks for 2017 and 2018 to help then acquire a franchis QB.

They did draft a safe 3rd round QB that has the smarts but not necessarily the arm Kessler.

This year the brought in Brock Osweiler. A QB that has a career winning record. A QB that has more career touchdowns than interceptions. A strong armed QB that has some potential if Hue can get it out of him.

Then drafted DeShone Kizer. A QB that looks the part but has had some issues. I think DeShone reminds me of Colin Kaepernick with a brain. He is big, fast, and intelligent but not always accurate. His footwork is not real clean so if he is taught and has the willingness to learn and clean up his foot work he could improve his accuracy.

If Brock and DeShone do not inspire confidence or wins the Browns could draft Darnold or Rosen in 2018 or put together quite a package with picks to trade up for one of these top QB's.

I think the bottom line is this: At this particular point in time, the Browns do not have their qb.

Right now? No, they do not.

But between Brock Osweieler and DeShone Kizer they have 2 options to attempt to find one.

Last year on May 1st the Cowboys had Tony Romo. Then they found their QB in development. Hopefully, this year we will find ours.

I don't understand. Kizer counts for two options?

DeShone Kizer is one option and Brock Osweiler is an option. Hopefully, one of them take over the position and become a huge find for the Browns.

I do not consider Kessler an option because he does not have the skill set to be a starter in the NFL.

What does Osweiler do better than Kessler?

(I don't think either is any good.)

Gotta disagree. We have 3 possibilities.

And I think Kessler is going to impress. I don't think he gets enough credit. The guy was a rookie, behind a terrible team. This year he knows the offense better, I think we'll see him throw the ball downfield more.

And we'll see, his arm strength is good enough to be decent.

Better than Oz and better than Kizer (at least for this year).

We all have our opinions and that is a good thing.

With that said, I think Kessler gets way too much credit on this board and is a huge problem on our offense that hurts many of the players who have to play w/him.

I think people like his stats and don't see what is really happening on the field of play.

Don't worry Browns fans I am sure there is a reason, Hue's mouthpiece Michael Silver keeps mentioning free agent Colin kaepernick as a possibility for the Browns. Our QB is coming lol

I wonder what the FO thinks of Hue blabbing to Silver all the time.

Link?

mentioned it on Total access and goodmorning football that the browns would look to add another QB, A Jay cuter or Kap.

This is the quote from the quote from the story Silver is pushing on TV:



That is a little different than:

My guess is there are other reasons why we don't go after Kaepernick:

http://www.citizen-times.com/story/news/...tion/100689186/

I agree. It's unfortunate we seem to have taken this stand back view of him. I am good with Brock, Cody, and Kiser as our QBs this year. Let's see who takes control and let them run with it.

As you said, like him or not, Brock is on the team. You need to root for him. He might be the guy leading the team opening game.

I agree that neither is any good, but Osweiler is at least a threat to go downfield, which would stop the other guys from putting 8 in the box, and maybe we can run the ball a bit.

It's not like Brock was slinging the ball down the field last year......... Just cause the guys 6'7 doesn't mean he's flinging it down the field. He had a better receiving core than we had, and it doesn't look to me via ProFootballReference like he's throwing hte ball all over the field.

I don't know too much about Brock, so this is what i have to go on. But he's got less Yards Per Attempt and Yards Per Completion vs Kessler. And Kessler has a higher Completion percentage.

So, it seems to me, that if Brock has this rocket arm, he wasn't using it last year. And this was on a team with a better run game than ours, and with DeAndre Hopkins and Will Fuller (who they drafted to stretch the field)

EDIT: Please correct me if I'm wrong if there's anyone whose actually watched a decent amount of the Texans last year......... As I said, I didn't. And Stats certainly don't always paint the picture

Not sure if I was the first to say it, but the name on the back of the jersey means nothing to me. whoever it is that leads us to wins, That's my guy...

Oh, I don't think anyone's rooting against Brock. Whoever is the QB who gives us the best chance to win, should be the one playing. I think it's more just speculation on who that guy will be and whether we think that guy's on the team.


When the game begins, folks will be rooting for whoever is the QB. At least until they start sucking, then we're ruthless IE Derek Anderson & Tim Couch Injuries with the booing (or cheering)

Pro Football Focus

It looks like Cody Kessler will be the Browns' starting QB heading into OTAs. He was one of the NFL's most accurate QBs in 2016.

To All:
Don't underestimate the Kessler.

I don't. He had a really good rookie year.

He has a year under the belt now. I think we will see more decisiveness in his actions.

Osweiler was worse at throwing downfield than Kessler last year and the same as Kessler when he was with the Broncos.

I called it before the draft, prepare for Cody to be your starting QB. It'll be nice to see him be able to take a snap and not immediately have to start worrying about dodging incoming people that want nothing more than to take his head off.

I'm really eager to see him after an offseason of working out too and he specifically said arm strength was one of the priorities he worked on.

I'm not even sure where Osweiler fits in. Quite frankly, I don't care either. I figured by now he'd been traded for whatever or just released.

Makes no sense to release him at this point.

First, he might do well for us. Second, wait until camps open and teams start looking for a QB when someone gets hurt or it is obvious that someone isn't going to be the back-up they hoped they would have.

There is a good chance we could trade him then. What we might get would depend on how dire the situation for the team in need.

I agree. The things he accomplished in the situation he was thrown into are remarkable. He has a lot to improve upon...but so does any 3rd Rd rookie going into his second year.

Go back and watch the second possession of the Patriots game...outstanding drive and a number of real NFL throws and decisions...against the eventual Super Bowl Champs, no less. (His only other two possessions in that game were cut short by Alvin Bailey deciding to not put a hand on the guy lined up across from him.)

My eye tells me he won't likely be a stud...but he could develop in the right situation.

And our line was so beat up/ non-productive he had to get rid of the ball FAST. Can't wait to see what he can do behind an upgraded OL...he isn't our best PHYSICALLY, but who cares if he gets us WINS. Go Browns!!!! Not against Brock, let him and others compete- best QB plays!!!

Who are you talking about? Kessler?

If so, he was 0 and 8 as a starter, so that kinda throws out the "who cares if he gets us WINS" comment.

Also, he did anything but get rid of the ball quick and took a ton of needless sacks.

Teams also game planned against him and took away our running game and dared him to beat them deep, which he was unable to do.

If you aren't talking about Kessler.............forget everything I just said and I apologize for this post. LOL

VDog, I acknowledge you are the end all and be all of all football knowledge...anyone making any statement against your almighty judgement be forewarned.
Kessler had no wins- true, last year. He played with two starting Gs gone, an ineffective center, and had to pass because our team was behind most of the time. JMHO, unlike your biased opinion, he played well for a rookie and has been praised in many publications as having a future in NFL as at least a backup/ I think he could easily be our starter. Brock has some catching up to do. Please feel free to ignore my posts because most of us ignorant poster know you are the only one who makes sacred insights and judgements....GO Browns!!!!

Wow!

I have yet to see anything praising Kessler (for football at least, easy to find stuff praising him for landing that girlfriend) and discussing his NFL future, so I would appreciate you pointing me that way.

If he is destined to be an NFL backup but could easily be our starter, then I think that says more about the team than Kessler.

Fact is, as has been said, when teams started stacking the box and forcing Kessler to beat them by going over the top, we lost our run game. Which was looking good at the beginning of the season. They continued to stack the box and Kessler could not (or would not) make them pay for that. Even coach Hue made comments about the QB needing to go downfield.

Maybe this offseason Kessler's stones dropped and he will finally challenge defenses who dare him to do that. Would be good to see what he can do. I am doubtful he can, or will. But would like to be wrong.

Teams also game planned against him and took away our running game and dared him to beat them deep, which he was unable to do.


Actually thats been Everyones game plan against us for geesh possibly a decade or so. Not necessarily the "deep" part but just saying OK Browns QB...Beat us if you can.

I do know Andrew Berry stated that the DEEP BALL was one of the best virtues they saw in Kizer...but I still think that is for the future.

As for assessing Kessler's career from last years perfomance as a Rookie rushed into the role of starter way before his time. That could be a mistake. Holding onto the ball, definitely he was over whelmed. I'd like to see how much he will progress. Just for the record...A QB like Brees struggled his first 2 seasons if you looked at his rookie season it would have been premature to lock him down as NOT GOOD. Not saying this will happen with Kessler. But he is very Accurate if he progresses and somewhere "GETS IT" he could become relevant to our Team.

jmho

Oh and for those harboring ill will to Vers for past actions.
Just to let you know I think he's been a good poster over the last week or so. The Vers I've liked, talking football and not other stuff. Oh I still don't like the grading of posts but if that is the worst, I'm there. Thanks Vers for getting back to football. Please stay the course and try not to get sucked into a tit for tat. I'm guilty of that too.

+1, Kessler is written off by many, never stated he was an all-pro, however he was a ROOKIE with 60 snaps in preseason and thrown to wolves- no other choice- http://www.espn.com/blog/cincinnati-beng...ns-cody-kessler , comments on Kessler are exactly what I stated AND note comments on our starting center- plus our guards were essentially gone too- Troy Aikman was written off his first year, like Brees- NOT saying Kessler at their status- but he can improve just like them- Versatile Dog- peace, you know more football than I, just expressing my thought about being a Browns fan for over 60 years....GO Browns!!!!

https://www.profootballfocus.com/pro-why-cody-kessler-should-be-clevelands-week-1-starter/ another article stating his weaknesses AND strengths- love his work ethic and JT praised his efforts- someone needs to beat him out- I'm rooting for him....GO Browns!!!

If Cody can be the guy that doesn't "lose games" then sure. Start him.

I just want a guy who's at least ganna get some 1st downs consistently. So our defense isn't dead by halftime.

Sorry but I'm not seeing it mentioned that he would be in league for years as a back up as you maintained.

I believe there is a chance he improves. If you care to read this entire board you'll see that's what the majority of posters are saying. I don't see anyone saying that based on last years performance that he's starting material in what he's shown as a rookie.

Most rookie QB's either show improvement or fade into the background. It can go either way. Kessler seems to be a smart kid so I believe a reason for hope exists that he improves. The question remains as to how much.

Let's not go overboard here.

Agreed Pit. Completely.

I do expect Kessler to be better. I do not, though, expect him to be good.

Better? He's the best one weve had since DA. At least as good as Hoyer and thats just in his rookie year.

I think what bothers me the most about this post is that two people actually "liked" it.

I did not call anyone ignorant. I did not say that I knew more than hitt. I did not say I have sacred insights and judgements.

I asked a question to clarify who hitt was talking about. I then gave my own personal opinions. What's the big deal?

I get questioned all the time. I give reasons why I think we should a guy like Barnidge and several posters disagree w/me. I don't fly off the freaking handle and post crap like hitt just did. It's a difference of opinion. Big freaking deal!!!!

I am not saying I am right or you are wrong. Again, people have different takes and freaking out and hurling insults is not very productive. And when people "like" posts that are nothing other than insulting..........it's a problem for this board and why it has went downhill.

Even if he is the best one we have had since DA, it does not necessarily make him good. It's like picking out which turd in a pile smells the least.

The QB position here in Cleveland has been devoid of talent for quite some time.

J/C

Anyone else Impressed on how Brock has carried himself through first, the outlandish trade, and then all this speculation on him basically being a dead man walking? Regardless of what you think of him as a QB, I haven't read anything disparaging he's stated. He's just come in and worked. Hard not to pull for him tbh, and if he is the bridge to Kizer, hope its Denver Brock not Houston.

And I agree, but would love a D which doesn't consistently surrender leads they may have in the second half. No lead was safe last year with that secondary and the anemic rush.

I am indeed. That had to of been a stressful situation (and probably still is to some extent) with not only him, but his family to. Not knowing where you'll be "living", something we probably take for granted every day.

I've nothing either except head down, mouth shut and coming in to work.

In all fairness, he hasn't had an opportunity to speak to the media. I think his agent probably told him it's best to keep his mouth shut and I think the team hasn't made him available yet.

So all that we're getting is reports from the Team's Management and stuff reporting on him. The only QB who has talked to the media is Kessler, and I don't think he's ever said anything bad about anyone. lol


EDIT: Looking at his twitter, he hasn't mentioned the Browns once, lol. I think he's on a strict, keep his mouth shut policy

Thought this was supposed to be about Osweiler?

My take is pretty simple about Osweiler. Have an open mind.

Denver liked him. Was ready to pay him big money. Houston did pay him big money. He has played.

He played poorly in Houston. That does not mean he can never play well again. Wipe the slate clean. Give him a chance. See what he can do.

The tape from last I admit does not look good. He looked lost and indecisive. Long arm slow release. But he has shown in the past that he can be accurate. Let's see what he can do.

Kessler as a rookie was thrown to the wolves. Played behind a poor OL with limited weapons. He played ok for a third round pick. He has had a year to figure things out and work on what he struggled with. He should improve from his experience and the additions to the OL.

Kizer at pick 52. Probably was drafted were he should have been. At the same time I doubt that he was 50 picks worse than Trubisky.

Between Trubisky, Watson Mahomes, and Kizer to me there was not much separation. They all had issues. In reality they were all kind of late first or second round picks.

Oh, if he wanted to go "that" route, there are plenty of avenues available to get his mindset out there.

How is my post not about Osweiller?

No offense. I was not responding to you. I just replied to the last post. I was reading the other posts. Kinda of a battle about Kessler.

Roger that. I was gonna say. My post was all about Osweiler, only bringing up Kessler saying that he's the only one QB besides Kizer who has spoken to the media, and he doesn't talk bad about anyone, lol

Another vote of confidence for Osweiler:



http://www.ohio.com/sports/browns/browns...om-him-1.766751

"He's competing."

Ouch.

I didn't take the quotes as a bad thing (as far as Brock's concerned). I took them as he's not locked in as the #2, he could be the starter.

lol, I love that phrase sometimes. I just remember Joe Girardi saying that about some minor league kid that had been brought up and put into a game that the Yankees were blown out in.

He said that he competed and made it through the game and did his role (which was, to throw a ridiculous amount of pitches as a relief pitcher, saving the other pitchers for later games, and finally getting enough outs to end the game, lol).

I don't think this is what it meant at all.

Yup, maybe it means that Kevin Hogan is looking good. That or watch out for Deshone Kizer

Can't wait till he begins battling.

Not a lot of talk about Brock, other than "He's terrible" but he does have experience, and he does have impressive measurables. I thought this was extremely interesting:

Hue: "It’s really interesting, and I told him this yesterday, I went back and watched a little bit of film of him from last year, and he looks much better right now. He is more compact. He is throwing the ball with a lot more velocity. He is doing a lot of good things. He needs to keep growing, just like I said all of our quarterbacks do.”

Link

Definitely something to keep our eye on.

I look at Brock's career and then I understand why there's not much talk about him. Positive talk anyway.

Is there a chance he could surprise us and end up winning out the starting role? Sure, look at his competition. Rookies and raw QBs pretty much. Is that chance high or likely? Questionable... at best. I assume most of us believed he wouldn't even be on the team at this point in time, and I think if someone offered a 7th and to eat a little of the money - he wouldn't be here.

All JMO

Brock is this year's RG3
All hype and very little hope.he's really no different
Than the RG3s Jake Delhommes of the past
One and done in Cleveland

Slow decision making .. long ass delivery .. not accurate at all ... he was so innacurate he rendered Hopkins useless ... thats very hard to do ... all u have to do is get the ball in his vicinity ... his catch radius may be the biggest ever ... i dont think folks understand just how bad u have to be to do that ...

Thats all from me ... enjoy dawgs ...

My opinion of Brock is that he wastes most of his physical gifts.

He is a huge guy but he has such a pronounced bend when dropping back that he makes himself smaller than Kessler. Cant see as he is dropping back so it makes it much harder for him to read the defense. Its Manziel.

He has a big arm but he doesn't push with his hips and legs and loses a ton of arm.

He holds the ball high then drops it for an elongated windup which really allows the defense to easily adjust to his already slow decision making.

He just wastes so much of his physical traits.

The good news is most of the bad I see are things that are correctable but the bad thing is, the guy isn't Kizer the rook, he is Brock the Vet and its often hard to coach these guys out of their bad habbits.


He stays vertical with a slight bend and he has a huge advantage of seeing the entirety of the field as he is dropping back. he has long legs so he doesn't have to take as big of a step in his drops to get deep and that allows him more time to view the field, set the feet and drive the ball down the field. Set the feet and his accuracy is gonna improve tremendously.

This is a good project for Hue. RG3 was a good project for Hue. These are the situations where u find out if he really is a QB whisperer lol

I am just very skeptical because his issues should have been fixed already but there is some serious physical talent to work with.

Another quote from Hue from the article above:

“It’s really interesting standing behind him because he is so tall. He is just looking on top of everybody and dropping balls down,” he said with a laugh.

As long as Brock gets better as he is working hard and complimenting Hue and QB coach Lee and improving his technique.

He will get a lot of reps in Preseason games as I'm 99% sure Kessler will remain pegged as #1. And I hope Brock play good.

Good enough for us to Trade him to the Broncos for a shiny penny
jmho

People keep saying he is inaccurate and cannot throw the deep ball. I don't know about that. Take a look:

How many times have posted this video now?

Hot take: I think Brock starts Week 1.

I wish he were a little faster with his release, but he looked better there than in another video someone posted here. Hell if he can take the job, I'm cool with that.

I'm not a big fan of his. I just think it might not be accurate to say he can't throw the deep ball. A couple of those deep throws were thrown w/beautiful touch and impeccable accuracy.

Something obviously went awfully wrong last year in Houston. But, it's probably too early to throw dirt on his grave. He had some good moments in Denver.

We were discussing him on another qb thread and one poster made it sound like he was playing so bad that he got benched for Manning before the playoffs. I posted an article that shed some light on the situation. Manning got hurt, BO came in and put up much better numbers than Manning had. Manning came back and you don't lose your job to injury, but people in Denver were talking about staying w/Brock because he had played better. Denver decided to go w/Manning for the playoffs. They won the Super Bowl. I think this version is much more accurate than the other versions. No one wanted to hear it, though.

I have been saying all along we shouldn't view him as some piece of trash throw-in to get a 2nd round pick.

He had to do something good along the way.

I have heard that O'Brien is, or can be, a difficult person. Some people don't respond to that type of coaching. If so, Hue seems to be at the other end of the spectrum.

That isn't saying that O'Brien is overly tough and that Hue is weak. It's just personality traits. If Brock responds to Hue's style of coaching, maybe we get the good Brock.

How good would that be?

O'Brien is the guy who had that crazy shouting match w/Tom Freaking Brady. Also, Joe Banner put out a series of tweets about how qbs hate O'Brien.

I doubt Osweiler works out, but I'm going to keep an open mind and see what Hue can do w/the guy.

j/c

Pluto article split into four parts: Brock, FO, OTAs & Pryor.

ABOUT BROCK OSWEILER

Maybe Brock Osweiler isn't the worst quarterback ever to set foot on the earth.

You wouldn't know that, based on all the whispers about Osweiler by the end of last season -- and they became almost screams when he was traded to the Browns.

Osweiler had a miserable 2016 season. He had some problems with coach Bill O'Brien. I'm not going to rehash all that. O'Brien has had three winning seasons with the Texans, so his opinion should count for something.

But as most fans know, Denver general manager John Elway liked Osweiler and wanted to sign him after the 2015 season.

Hue Jackson has adopted a much more upbeat tone about the 6-foot-7 quarterback since Osweiler has been around the coaching staff for several weeks.

"I don't judge people by what everybody else says," said Jackson. "I judge them by what I see. But everybody has a reputation ... his was a little different. He's not any of that ... he's been outstanding in the building."

Jackson also praised how Osweiler has been throwing the ball, how he's made some adjustment from a year ago.

This is progress. The Browns can't simply dismiss a quarterback with a 13-9 career record as a starter because of a rocky season in 2016.

Link

He could be the answer regardless of his Meteoric fall from 2015 to 2016. One season does not a career make.
My negatives came from his inconsistent accuracy and his flawed technique. Now if Hue and Lee can tutor him out of his flaws. Who knows.

Quite frankly I think we are trying to build him up to get a good return for him in a trade. Kizer is the future in that QB room.

Either way, our FO did an amazing job on this one. If Brock actually turns out to be a successful QB we are the ones that GOT a 2nd round pick not us giving it away...lol

Or we build him up and a needy team trades for him or Lynch in Denver simply is not making the grade. I can see them wanting him don't know how Elway's ego plays in that one as BO chose Texans offer.

??? Did Texans force Brock on O'brien? Cause he did his best to make it fail from what I saw.

jmho

I've been doing a bit of investigating. Came across this:



So, I went to YouTube and tried to find that video, but they didn't have his highlights from that game.

In that game, Osweiler had some poor throws. He also had some very nice throws. I am not getting the part that he can't throw the ball deep. He actually throws a beautiful deep ball.

Check out the game here:




I then went to the Bears game because that game was mentioned in the first article I posted and it was in week 1 of the 2016 NFL season.

Osweiler had good throws and bad throws, but again, he threw some incredibly beautiful deep passes, including a couple of drops. Check out the pass at around the 2:40 mark that Fuller drops. It doesn't get much better.

I see some mechanical issues w/Osweiler that need to be fixed. His front foot is similar to Kizer's. Has to be corrected. Has to hold the ball higher. Etc. But, I not only think that he can throw the deep pass, I actually think it is a strength. Look for yourselves:

I like that he takes his shots downfield. That opens up the running game. I also like that his misses downfield are generally overthrows. I don't like underhthrown deep balls.

This is kind of off-topic, but I have to mention it out of admiration.

Stinkin' Bill Belichick. How great is he?

Against Houston, he adjusts his defense after watching what Houston and Osweiler did against the Bears and Chiefs, which was namely kill them w/deep passes. He takes that away and Houston's offense went south.

Then, he plays us and we are leading the league in rushing and throwing a lot of shorter passes to one side of the field. He adjusts, sells out to stop the running game and forces us to make longer throws, whether they are vertical or horizontal.

The guy is amazing!

Is he amazing or is it just common sense? What's more amazing is that other coaches aren't smart enough to do the same type of things.

I would venture to guess that in any profession 90% of the employees that make up that profession are average to incompetent.

I think he is amazing. And then you see other teams copying New England's defensive game plans.

I have nothing but respect for the guy.

I agree, Rish does have a point....How come not many other coaches would decide to shutdown the deep pass that they beat other Teams with? Is it ego? or just because they beat so & so doesn't mean they can beat us? It's like New England is the only Team that knows how to adjust and do things differently. I have a hard time believing that, still it does seem like he's just about the only coach that takes the time to study their opponent, wonder what everyone else does?

I just finished saying that other teams do copy what he does. Not sure what you are talking about?

Btw---------any thoughts on the videos of Brock and whether or not he can throw the deep ball?

Which brings up a second point
Remember Pettin? and his little buddy? They would talk about having a party after a victory and drinking and carrying on. And this was in the middle of the week. Then there was talk of Farmer and not taking time to talk with Gilbert, now you have to wonder, Just What Did These Guys Do? And How Often? Maybe between the Team business and All the other Team stuff, just how much time do they have to game plan? I think alot of them just coast until the wheels fall off because their already making big bucks.

Yeah, I know. Thats what I'm referring to. It seems like not many coaches out there are willing to put in the time like Belicheck does.

Did you happen to watch the three videos on Brock?

I brought up BB and that's my fault. I'm sorry.

I do have some thoughts on Brock. I'd like to discuss them if anyone is interested. Kinda like we did about Kizer on the Hue being a QB Whisperer thread. People seemed to like that thread. We could discuss some things about Brock's game here.

Any takers?

LOL........I am not feeling very confident on takers.

Not really...I'm old school. If it's a completed pass it's a good one, if it's not, then it's a bad pass. I don't watch anything thats not Browns so until he steps on the field as a Brown, then I won't know. I do think he got a bad rap in houston, anybody that gets offered that much money has to have something to offer. Nobody makes that much being a bad QB.

No taker for me. Discussing Brock is not an interesting topic to me.

But I'll make one more comment on BB. My original comment wasn't to diminish him or his accomplishments. The guy is fanrastic, obviously, and certainly relative to his peers. I just think a lot of what he does just makes good sense.

Why would you not be interested in educating yourself?

Oh..........and that is a serious question. I am not being snarky at all.

I am. On things I find interesting.

Thats me in a nutshell. The Browns is the only thing I find interesting in Football anyway.

Certainly explains some things. LOL

What does it explain?

Involved in this is the way he has constructed his team with the flexibility to adapt his defense to restrict his opponent's offensive strengths. Many teams are built with specific strengths and when they have to make these kinds of adjustments weaken themselves in the process. He builds his teams so that it doesn't matter, he fields players who can do what is needed.

I don't think I've ever said that Osweiler can't throw the deep ball. I think that he didn't throw it last year, for whatever reason, and turned the ball over like crazy. That led to him having the worst QB season in recent memory.

If he can return to his Denver self, which may not have been the real thing, then he is better than I thought (but still not good).

I think it means thats why I'm always pro Browns and they can do no wrong. Now thats does stop when their no longer Browns, but when their Browns it's Win---Win Baby!

Several people have said that about his deep passes. I wasn't specifically thinking about any one poster. Wasn't trying to be insulting. I just kind of took everyone's word for it. Later, I decided to actually look. I was pretty amazed.

He does have issues. No doubt. LOL

But, he might not be a lost cause. I hope a couple of guys will discuss his strengths, weaknesses, and potential w/me. If not, I might just have to talk to myself.

I want to take some time and look at those videos. On another note, Bellickick is on a complete other level. I was so excited when we hired him, then... Well you know. At its base, on D, the man takes what you do best and removes it from the equation, the exploits your weaknesses on offense. Simple philosophy but oh so effective. I know he has a soft spot for Cleveland and to this day I morn for what might have been.

i agreei don't know how to do the plus 1

I don't think he wasn't any good. Elway wanted to sign him. Just not at the amout Houston paid.

Everything was wrong for him in Houston. He signs the big contract, so he is looked as the savior. He had a coach who didn't want him in the first place and made sure to make it a bad fit.

I think he now has a coach who can help him along and a fan base that doesn't expect much. That equals a good situation for him. I expect to see the guy hit his stride. Who knows? In time history might make fans around the country wonder how we ever got that guy.

Teams and coaches TRY to copy Belichick but few if any succeed. The guy is one of a kind. He is truly amazing. He was as a DC and he is as an HC. Belichick and Paul Brown are neck and neck as greatest ever in my opinion. Never thought I see anyone come close to Brown but.....

For real ... your take is that O'Brien (who i think is a jack ass) sabotaged his own team to prove a point ... WOW ... thats worse than what mac says ... *LOL* ...

Now i have heard it all ...

His Throwing mechanics are side armed..Reminds me Of Bernie.Not saying it's good or bad.. It all depends on whether he completes the passes or not...

It also appears he misses simple reads..even the 2 man route..His accuracy and decision making is questionable. Not sure just how much of a football IQ he has.

I am impressed with his interview and how he states how much Coach Hue and Coach Lee have been helping him with the basics and how learning the basics is such a large part of the QB's success.

Well, it may have sounded like that, but that isn't what I meant. Lets just say he was making a point to his GM that this guy wasn't his QB of choice.


We'll see how it works out here.

Yes, he did throw some nice deep balls in those videos. some were long frozen ropes. I saw a couple overthrows under pressure, and a couple INTs that probably shouldn't have been thrown. Some intermediate nice throws, and a couple head scratchers. Sometimes it almost looks like he "shot puts" the ball. Weird kind of pushing motion, rather than a nice smooth follow through. And I also noticed his tendency to "throw smaller" almost like he keeps his throwing hand close to his shoulder instead of coming over the top. I'm assuming these are some of the things Hue is working with him on. I certainly see no reason to write him off at this point. He has the measurables, and seems fairly mobile for a guy his size. I'm going to try to watch some more tape on him this week.

What's your opinion on this Peen..

If a coach purposely doesn't put his players in the best possible position to perform well for reasons of teaching his GM anything, what do you think of that coach?

If I'm the owner, that guy is fired.. (assuming I can prove it)

As an owner you really don't have to prove it. You only have to believe that it's true. You have the power to fire people at will. I mean, you've seen that a lot as a Browns fan haven't you?

No coach in the league will lose just to spite somebody. They would be putting their career on the line. Sometimes QB's just don't fit the scheme and some coaches lack the ability to adjust their scheme to fit the talent they've been given.

K ...

Thats the buety Mr. Peen ... we will find out ...

WOOF WOOF!!!!

j/c:

I am going to answer questions from Canada and lamp that were in the OTA thread. I don't want to make that thread solely a Brock thread. I am also going to give a few other observations. I have watched only 4 game videos and the low-light video-, so I really don't have a complete picture, but I thought I'd get the ball rolling and see if anyone else is interested in educating themselves.

Canada mentioned about Brock looking at his primary receiver and then checking down if the dude wasn't open.

Yep, from what I saw...and again that is limited....he most certainly did do that. Good observation, Canada. That's a problem, no doubt.

lamp mentioned that his delivery might be too slow. I don't really see that, bro. It might be that he is so tall that he looks slow. I actually thought he was rushing his delivery. LOL.

A few observations on Brock [and again.......I only watched four games and the low-light video.]

Strengths:

--Throws a beautiful deep ball. It still amazes me how some posters claim he can't throw deep. One poster even said Cody was better at it.

--Has a great touch on many passes, but especially on the deep passes.

--Very accurate on many deep throws and crossing routes

--Way better runner and athlete than I imagined.

--Very nice arm and he trusts it. [Wait until you see the negatives on this point. LOL]

--Can throw on the move, especially when moving to his right.


Concerns:

--Doesn't go through progressions, in the games I saw.

--Makes some really bone-headed decisions.

--Sometimes gets out of whack w/his mechanics. Front leg gets too far out to the left and he throws a worm burner.

--Hurries too much. Relax mon.

--Trusts his arm way too much.

--Throws some inaccurate passes that make me scratch my head.


Some other thoughts:

--His receivers dropped a ton of balls. Fuller had bad hands at ND and he dropped a ton. So did Hopkins, the RBs, and the TE. Just watch the videos I posted and you can easily see that.

--There seemed to be a lot of miscommunication. Throws would go to one area and the receiver would cut in the other direction. That was especially true w/Fuller. That is to be expected. New, inexperienced qb in a new offense and a rookie WR. Stuff happens.

--I laughed my ass off at the low-light video. Many of the throws the dude put on there were very good. There were drops, guys running the wrong routes, pass interferance [you could see the ref starting to throw the flag on one of them,] tight coverage, etc. For those who understand the game, it was almost like an apologist video for Brock's issues.

With that said.........I am NOT apologizing for him. He has some real concerns that need to be fixed.

Summary:

Hmmmmm..........I don't know. I see talent. Way more talent than Cody. I absolutely love his touch and accuracy on the deep balls. I hate how he makes bone-headed throws. I think Hue might be able to coach him up and we might have something w/the guy. I am not saying he is "the guy," but at this point, I won't rule it out.

Would love to see some honest discussion by those willing to educate themselves, rather than "he sucks," types of posts.

Vers, I went back on NFL.com, and looked up Osweiler's pre-draft review. You hit on many of the same points regarding positives and negatives as they did. It's an interesting read if you want to look it up.

The description of him on there reads like a Browns fan's Christmas list: big, strong arm, mobile, athletic, can make all the throws, etc.

I'd be a happy fan if Osweiler ends up as a good, quality starter. Then again, I'll be a happy fan if any of the guys on our roster end up as a good, quality starter.

Ham........would you be willing to post that profile on this thread? I'd like to see it. It might help others who want to be educated, too.

As far as his arm he sounds a bit like Derek Anderson except DA had no touch. More like Vinny Testaverde after he learned how to throw it away instead of forcing it.

DA had a beautiful touch on his deep passes. But, while Brock has a strong arm.............I don't think it compares to DA's.

Vers I should have said DA had no touch on the short passes. If I remember correctly, his short and intermediate passes were all fastballs.

I agree.

Lawrence Vickers had really good hands for a FB.

Because he had to.. for his own safety..

Here's the review:

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2012/profiles/brock-osweiler?id=2533436

I agree with you on the lowlights not being as bad as I expected. However, they brought up the concern that his receivers didn't really seem to be trying to make plays for him fairly often. Hopkins is/was a great receiver, but he seemed to give up on a lot of balls that he could have possibly caught/at least should have attempted to catch. I don't know if they quit on him/O'Brien or if the receivers just had trouble tracking his balls for some reason (spin?, trajectory?, wrong shoulder?, "movement"?).

He looks the part, but are the intangibles there? Does he have issues, or were there issues with his contract-"a to whom much is given, much is expected" deal?

I'm not trying to make conclusions in this post, just trying to look at different angles.

I would really hope that no coach in the league would do something on purpose to make a player less than he can be.

Vickers? We gotta get that guy!!

Vers,

You mentioned that he had occasionally threw some head scratchers... were you able to get a sense of when those types of throws would happen? As in, the game was on the line, or they needed an important 3rd down? I guess what I'm asking is do these negatives rear their heads as a result of the pressure of the situation?

Thanks Ham. You're right. Some of the same things are occurring. I'll copy and post it here:

I didn't notice that, but I only watched 4 videos plus the low-light one.

He did seem to make some dumb decisions when he was pressured heavily in the pocket, but that's true of almost all quarterbacks.

Two things kinda stood out to me w/his bad throws:

1. He trusts his arm a lot. He takes chances.

2. This is going to sound weird and maybe it is...LOL...but, it's like there are times when there is a short-circuit between his brain and his body. There were a few throws where he just looked somewhat spastic and threw a dart into the dirt. LOL......looked crazy as heck.

I've been thinking about this a lot and haven't reached a true conclusion, but I am at the point where I certainly wouldn't just hand him the keys to the team, but I wouldn't cut him, either. I think he has enough talent and enough good film to allow him to compete for the starting position. And, it's not like we have an Aaron Rodgers or Tom Brady back there.

I just hope the media and fans won't be brutal if he indeed gets a shot. That can really derail things for a team and the player.

I think reviewing some of his Denver videos from 2015 might be helpful in assessing his QB skills as he would certainly have been more comfortable and knowledgeable in that offense.

I posted the video of Brock playing against New England while he was w/Denver. It's almost at the very bottom of page 5 if you want to check it out.

Thanks. He looked like a completely different QB in Denver than in Houston and that would be understandable given his time in that offense, especially working with Manning. Much more confident in that offense.

How similar is Hue's offense to Kubiak's? I know that they had a zone blocking run oriented scheme.

Yep — Mister Potato Cannon. Force it through a brick wall. Did he ever throw a fade ever?

It reads like he's basically Kelly Holcomb mentally (see weaknesses) with Derek Anderson's strengths.

If Hue can get him to keep the gunslinger in check for a year, he could do well.

Yeah, I was just wondering if he's the kind of guy who goes to crap when it comes to crunch time. Doesn't necessarily sound like it's the case which is good.

That short-circuit thing you were talking about kind of sounds like a guy who changes his mind in mid throw... either he suddenly doesn't think he'll make it or the defender makes a break and it's too late to stop the throwing motion?

As to the fickleness of fans... I don't think it looks good for this trio.. except maybe Kizer. If either Brock or Cody start and look like crap, it wo't be long until the other is called for. If Kizer is on the field, I think collectively there will be a little more tolerance, but if his play is costing us wins...

Watching him, does anyone get the feeling that the game just hasn't "slowed down" for him? Players always talk about when they start to feel comfortable with the game speed of the NFL and start seeing things better. With Osweiler's head scratch moments and issues in progressions, maybe he just hasn't hit that point where he's calm on the field.

The blow-ups with O'Brien in Houston could add credence to this. If he's already having problems processing what he's seeing, having your coach jump down your throat on the issue would certainly cause some head butting as, in Brock's mind, he's doing all he can.

Osweiler has some sick physical gifts but the mental part of the game hasn't seem to have really clicked yet. Maybe a fresh start with no expectations will help that happen. Or maybe he's just one of many talented players that just can't deal with NFL game speed.

Brock Osweiler ranks high in air yards and what that means

http://brownswire.usatoday.com/2017/06/0...hat-that-means/

New Cleveland Browns quarterback Brock Osweiler is generally regarded as one of the NFL’s least effective and most inefficient throwers. However, the big former Texans starter does rank highly in one category: air yards.

It’s a somewhat confusing moniker, but air yards are the percentage of the total passing yards gained strictly from the throw. It leaves out all the yards after the catch. Quarterbacks who rank high in air yards tend to complete passes farther down the field.

The good folks at Pro Football Focus broke down how Osweiler compared in 2016 against the Cleveland triumvirate at QB in air yards.



Pro Football Focus
✔
@PFF

Comparing the air yards of veteran QBs on the Browns roster from the 2016 season.
4:16 AM - 9 Jun 2017

His No. 6 overall ranking shows Osweiler is more successful at throwing the ball down the field than any of the Cleveland QBs, notably the one who remains, Cody Kessler, who ranked No. 21 out of 37.

Context is important here. One reason why his air yards are so high is that Osweiler is relatively terrible on short throws. He doesn’t have a lot of 4-yard outs on his resume because he’s wildly inaccurate with them. Osweiler thrives at throwing the 10-to-20 yard passes, which were more of a staple of Houston’s offense than what the Browns did in Hue Jackson’s first year in Cleveland too.

Osweiler thrives at throwing the 10-to-20 yard passes, which were more of a staple of Houston’s offense than what the Browns did in Hue Jackson’s first year in Cleveland too. The Texans only threw 64 passes to the running backs all season, while the Browns threw more than double that many at 139 total.

If Osweiler can improve his accuracy on the more frequent shorter throws in Jackson’s offense, his willingness and ability to attack more down the field provides Osweiler a legit feather in his cap over Kessler in their QB battle this summer.

They spent a lot of time working on footwork and lower body with Kizer and Brock and I have already seen some of it paying off in his drop backs and hip rotation. This should lead to better accuracy especially in the short to mid areas.

I'm not really sure. Haven't tried to compare them. I do know that there was a lot of talk about how completely different Denver and Houston's offenses were and how that might have led to some of his issues.

I do think that Hue can be good for Brock.

Like Mourg said, he might fix some of his mechanical issues. Also, Hue is pretty darn good at play design and play calling and he can probably take advantage of Brock's strengths and keep teaching him along the way.

I like the possibility of this because I think that having a qb who can challenge the defense will really open up the running game and keep defenses honest.

Not having enough time in O'Brien's system would also exacerbate that problem, no?

Having a guy like Gordon that could blow the top off a defense to go with an arm as big as Brock's would be kinda nice, and REALLY help the running game.


What's Randy Moss up to these days?

TV, I think.

But yeah, Gordon's ability to stretch the D would be huge w/a guy like Osweiler at qb.

We have to hope that Coleman can become the deep threat he was in college.

Just did a quick search, Ricardo Louis ran a 4.43 at the combine, and Jordan Payton ran a 4.47. Either one of these guys is fast enough to stretch a defense, aren't they? Even if it's just to keep one CB honest.

I think Coleman ran a 4.37.

Louis caught some deep passes at Auburn, but he has a lot of drops.

Coleman was a very good deep threat in college.

j/c...

checked pages 5, 6, 7 and didn't see this anywhere so I hope I'm not duplicating.

I thought this was a very good breakdown of Brock by a Texan fan after they signed him. Of course as we know it didn't turn out good. But I liked the way he broke down Brock in Denver.
So again...who knows???

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XBs3zEwnmJM

If you want to win games this year, Brock has to be the opening day starter going in. Hue knows this too, he is just making Brock earn it, and he will beat Kessler because Brock is more talented plain and simple.

Brock had one bad year, big deal...one year a career it does not define.

Brock will bounce back under Jackson's offense and have a pretty good year, a year good enough to keep Kizer on the bench so he can learn the pro game and learn the offense.

also, you never know...Brock may be the guy here for the next few years...wouldn't it be funny we win the big one with Brock and the Texas gave him to us and gave us a draft pick for him? lol

the Texans would never live that one down

Seriously though, I think many Browns fans will be pleasantly surprised with Brock. Hue seems to love him, and he will soak up everything Hue teaches like a sponge. The kid is hungry, he wants to prove last year was a fluke. This kid has the potential to do big things, and Brock is still young yet...plenty of room to grow.

I don't believe anyone can say with the least bit of confidence which QB will win the competition. All 3 have sucked up to now, Brock has looked slightly better with no pressure. We will see what happens when things go live.

Personally, I think it will be either Brock or Kizer because of their size and arms but of those 2, it could really be either. Now if Hue decides all suck and his best option is the game manager that wont make a lot of mistakes then that is Cody.

Lets just hope one man steps up and claims the position and its not he sucked a little bit less than the next guy or like last year with mcCown, I dotn want to compete here RG3 u have it

My preference is to roll with Kessler. He takes care of teh ball. The ONLY reason Brock might get the nod is based on arm strength. I dont trust his decision making abilities whatsoever.

I am all for giving Brock a chance, but I think you may have went a bit overboard.

A question or two for you.

Did it not bother you how teams game-planned against Kessler and took away the run and half the field? Or, are you one of those posters that maintain I am making that up?

You have posted how NE game planned against Kessler like 1000 times. Not once have I questioned it, lol.

I just prefer a guy who can take care of the ball. Kessler does that, and I expect him to grow and hopefully with some good coaching and play calls, he'll improve.

I was just asking, Turk.

I think it is inappropriate to have a preference.

Insufficient information to make a call.

It should be questioned because it didn't happen. Kessler was in for three series that game. The second series was the best scoring drive we've had in a looooooong time. The other two series were ended by NE scheming against the Erving/Bailey duo who nearly got CK killed.

Other teams may have schemed against CK to take away parts of the field...but NE isn't one of them.

There is a poster who keeps saying that I am making things up about NE's scheme against the Browns. He says they didn't. He says that Cody only played three series.

I think most of you know this, but in case you don't.........teams develop their game plans before the game and don't wait until a guy has played three series to start making a game plan. Also, I have even posted an article on the matter that supports my position. ed posted one earlier this year but I can't find that one now. One more thing.....I believe that some of you know that I understand alignments and schemes from my coaching and scouting days. I am not making anything up. Period.

I've stood on the sidelines marveling at all the posts debating this ... i can't watch anymore ... its turned into a car wreck ... *LOL* ...

CK vs NE ...

Drive 1 - 2 hand offs and an incomplete pass on 3rd down ..

Drive 2 - long TD drive aided by a penalty ..

Drive 3 - a hand off and a drop back ... not sure he made it to the end of his drop before he was CRUSHED and fumbled ...

U be the judge ...

Not sure why this is such a hot topic ... weather Vers is right or wrong about NE and everyone learning to game plan against us .. WHO CARES ..

Any DC with a half a brain was going to make CK beat them with 15 + yard throws in the air and stack the box against the run ... CK simply didn't throw the ball downfield last year ..

Vers is 100% correct in how teams game planned for us with CK as the QB .. 100% correct ... only an idiot would argue that .... I believe he's wrong about teams emulating NE's scheme to learn how to game plan him ... i said WRONG ... not that Vers was lying or making crap up .. i simply don't agree with his assessment that others "learned" from NE how to scheme for him ... I believe even the WORST D-coordinator ever would have figured that one out ...

I think u guys are splitting hairs over HOW teams figured out how to game plan for a CK quarterbacked Browns team last year ...

Actually that has been the same game plan for years...no real revelation there. No matter who we had at QB for quite some times its been...We are going all out to stop the run...Whoever is at QB this week will have to beat us if they can and we might as well commit to pressure.

On the Brock front. I still say the overall accuracy of Kessler and assumed progress is going to have him at the starter. The thought of Brock absolutely with NO CHANCE to become the starter has now elevated his status but he just has a big hill to climb.

jmho

Yet Hue, who loves to give positive re-enforcement to his players in order to motivate them, felt the need publicly call him out for refusing to press the ball downfield. You yourself admit that opposing D's have game planned for years now to force our QB to beat them and Cody simply could not do that.

I don't see a hill to climb for any of our QB's. It's the same problem you mentioned. Who can push the ball down the field to force their D to respect our passing game.

I don't think the weakest arm of the top three really has an advantage in that battle.

If Brock starts .. its more an indictment of CK not improving at all than it is that BO is any good .. that guy STUNK IN DENVER and was worse in Houston .. .look at the weapons hes played with in those two places ... *LOL* at him excelling here ...

Looks like you have a personal stalker ... very shocked at who it is ... very shocked ... oh well .. life's full of surprises ...

Responses are bolded above. The POINT is bolded, italicized and underlined and are your words.

We agree what teams were doing to stop us...I think EVERYONE sees/saw that...but it didn't happen that way against NE while CK was in the game. If that's splitting hairs, so be it.

I know better than to challenge someone's critique of schemes, alignments, techniques, etc. I am NOT that guy and I've readily admitted that on this board. But I DO watch the games...twice or more on most occasions because I like to learn and re-watch the games after reading posters' comments in post-game threads.

CK was in for (3) series. Two ended on the third play of the series after a blitzer came through the line basically untouched. The other one was arguably the best drive of the year. That doesn't change the way to defend him and that doesn't make him THE guy. The only thing 'exposed' to other teams that day was simply how bad the Erving/Bailey combo could be.

j/c:

This thread is a good example of how certain posters can ruin a thread. Not too long ago in this thread, I posted a series of videos and tried to talk about Brock's strengths and weaknesses in those games. That seems like football talk to me. Didn't get too many replies, but we got one poster doing his best to make this about board personalities and others joining in on that conversation.

Follow his lead. It's productive.

Here is a quote from YOU in THIS thread:

"This is kind of off-topic, but I have to mention it out of admiration.

Stinkin' Bill Belichick. How great is he?

Against Houston, he adjusts his defense after watching what Houston and Osweiler did against the Bears and Chiefs, which was namely kill them w/deep passes. He takes that away and Houston's offense went south.

Then, he plays us and we are leading the league in rushing and throwing a lot of shorter passes to one side of the field. He adjusts, sells out to stop the running game and forces us to make longer throws, whether they are vertical or horizontal.

The guy is amazing!"

Just following your lead.

jc:

Brock Osweiler takes blame for 'poor decisions, poor throws' with Texans

Unloaded to the Cleveland Browns in a classic Moneyball style salary dump after a horrible one-and-done season with the Texans, quarterback Brock Osweiler acknowledged blame for his shortcomings last year.

In his most candid remarks since being traded to the Browns where he's drawn solid reviews from coach Hue Jackson as he competes for a starting job with Cody Kessler and rookie DeShone Kizer, Osweiler discussed where he regressed with the Texans after signing a four-year, $72 million contract.

"The best part is I'm getting coached hard on my fundamentals," Osweiler told Cleveland reporters. "And I believe firmly that when your fundamentals and your feet are right as a quarterback, you're going to make great decisions and you're going to throw accurate footballs.

"I think that's something that slid last season. I'm not going to go into great detail on that, but they did. My fundamentals slid, and because of that, you saw some poor decisions and some poor throws. If you go back to 2015, I feel like my fundamentals were pretty tight."

Osweiler was essentially sold to the Browns in exchange for the Texans sending them a 2018 second-round draft pick and a 2017 sixth-round draft pick, netting a 2017 fourth-round pick in the exchange as Cleveland assumed responsibility for his $16 million guaranteed base salary. The Texans saved $10 million in salary-cap space and $16 million in cash this season.

Osweiler won one playoff game with the Texans last season, beating an Oakland Raiders team that was without injured starting quarterback Derek Carr. However, he was intercepted three times in their AFC divisional-round loss to the eventual Super Bowl champion New England Patriots.

Benched late in the season and replaced by Tom Savage before Savage suffered a concussion in the regular-season finale that forced Osweiler back onto the field, the towering quarterback finished the regular season with 15 touchdowns and 16 interceptions for a 72.2 passer rating.

In his final season with the Denver Broncos prior to joining the Texans as a free agent, Osweiler went 5-2 as a starter and passed for 1,967 yards, 10 touchdowns and six interceptions and an 86.4 passer rating.

"I think I did a pretty good job in 2015 of protecting the ball," Osweiler said. "Last year, I didn't do such a good job. So coming into this camp and this team and this system, I had a very large focus on making great decisions with the football, and I feel like for the most part, I've done that this camp."

http://www.houstonchronicle.com/sports/t...twitter-premium

Brock had some skills... Something that john Elway wanted to retain. So, I can't tell you what happened in Houston, but I'm pretty sure he not nearly as bad as Texas made it seem but he's probably not as great as Elway made it seem.

I'd gladly take something in between those two.. hope it leans more towards Elways thinking.

I think we both know that some of these articles should be taken with a grain of salt. It was a good read but I do believe it's way too early in the process to say any of our QB's have a leg up on being the starter on day one of the regular season.

What I will say is it seems Kizer is taking a lot of reps with the ones right now and there is buzz surrounding Brock. Enough so that all of the posters who claimed that Cody was the destined day one starter should be reconsidering that idea. lol

I don't believe that Brock has taken a single 1st team rep in the OTAs a d Mini Camps yet.

I'd be a little bit cautious about him thus far.

Both Kiser and Cody have taken the 1st team reps, but Kiser has taken at least some of those against the #2 defense.

Hogan has taken a lot of the 3rd team reps.

100% agree with the grain of salt comment.

My takeaway from this article is... what about Cody Kessler? Why isn't anyone talking about him? That worries me (as much as you can get worried about someone who you don't think is going to be your starting QB past the midpoint of this season).

The fact that cody has had a year in this system and was given top billing for mini and ota's, yet he has not shown to be better than the raw rookie. He has to protect his position and he has already allowed the rookie to outshine him. Hell he may be in danger of being the 4th QB soon. Hogan has had a stellar camp from all I have heard.

Just my point of view.

I think Brock will be the starter.

He has more NFL experience. Kessler is simply not starter material.

Brock was good enough in Denver to get offered a huge contract by Elway. Good enough to sign a big contract with Houston. He was a second round pick and has been in the league five years.

He played poorly in Houston. He was ok in Denver. Kessler has one year in the NFL and is a limited player physically. Neither guy is much to speak of but Osweiler has more tools an more experience.

Not sure if it means much but Osweiler was humbled big time from his Houston experience and his subsequent drop in value. He is saying the right things and is highly motivated.

I would give him the edge in beating out Kessler.

Kizer will get his chance. When will depend on a number of factors. But most likely sometime after the half way mark.

He is making good progress according to all reports. It is imperative that Kizer start at some point in order for management to access his future and the future of the Browns in next years draft.

I don't think the article is saying that he is going to be the starter. I think it's more about that the perception was that he was either going to be traded or cut and he has done enough to at least be permitted to compete for the job.

I think some posters are not willing to keep an open mind and do the research and instead automatically dismiss him. I have no idea who is going to start or be number 2. I just think it's important to keep an open mind at this point. Right now, I think the qb job is wide open, but I could be wrong about that.

I can only tell you what I read a while back, and this is from my recollection... He apparently had a watered down offense when he was in Denver because they didn't want to overwhelm him. In Houston, they had a very complex offense that did overwhelm him.

As well, my 2 cents...in Denver he was fighting to get a big money contract. In Houston, he had that big money contract. I can only imagine that he wants to keep making that big money and he has refocused to maximize the chance that he keeps the contract, knowing that if he gets cut, next contract will be small in comparison.

I agree Vers. Let the best guy be the man; what happened before doesn't matter. If it's Brock, Cody, Kizer or Hogan - let us improve with the guy who is the best choice. Let us start winning divisional games. Let's start the journey to where we all belong.

I take what is being written about Osweiler with a grain of salt because I realize the front office would like to build his value if they are thinking about trading him.

I find it very difficult to believe B.O. and his $18 mill salary have much of a future in Cleveland.

What I have heard is just a little different. I heard that Denver's offense was more qb friendly and not nearly as complex as Houston's offense. I don't think Denver's O was "watered down" for Brock. I just think that was their offense.

I think your right and I also think Daman has a point. I don't care who you are...You don't offer big time starting QB money like Denver did and then Houston to someone who you think would make a so-so backup or a 3rd string QB. Just not gonna happen.
Someone or Someones saw something in him to pay him like a starter, not just one pair of eyes. Like I said before I don't care who you are, there's something there.

We don't know for certain who will the signal caller vs the Steelers for sure
But I do know this.....
As long as this franchise is test driving QBs trying to find the answer
It will never see a winning season much less .500.
Osweiler is no better than the RG3 Delhommes and whatever other QBS they have found in the discard pile.
Osweiler was fools good. Plain and simple.
3 teams in 3 years
If you have to go through 3 qbs to see what you have then you don't have 1.

If Denver thought he was so good ... why did they bench him for the playoffs for a guy that had thrown 9 TD's and 17 picks and wasn't deemed healthy enough to start the season final ...he came in for the last quarter of that game or so .... a guy that literally couldn't throw the ball 30 yards down field ...

How does that work? ..

Then he followed it up by being benched for the immortal Tom Savage ... ya ... u ever heard of him? ...

Houston got Scott Mitchelled ...

Yeah.

We should of just stuck with Couch Wynn McCown Frye Quinn McCoy Weeden Manziel Kessler ...wait.

What are you talking about?

Why was Denver willing to offer him starter money then? Elway wanted to keep him. Just saying, People wanted him, there's a reason.

Again ... the proof is in the pudding ... he was benched for the playoffs for a guy that hadn't played in 5 - 7 weeks and had thrown for 9 TD's and 17 picks ...

U can't explain that one ...

FOOLS GOLD BABY ... theres a long list of them ... Matt Flynn ... Matt
Cassell ... many many more ...

The numbers they throw around are impressive ... but what really matters is how much is GAURANTEED and when it's GAURANTEED ... no clue why GAURANTEED keeps getting capatilized ... crap ... its pretty depressing when I'm not smarter than my keyboard ... *LOL* ..

Look at what Glennon got this year ... everyone said it meant they wouldn't draft a QB in round 1 cause they gave him him 15 mill over 3 years ... in reality it was a one year contract with 18 mill GAURANTEED ... all in year 1 ...

Yes ... Mike Glennon the STUD Mike Glennon got 15 million a year according to the contracts total numbers ...

It'll play out here ... I've made my prediction ... he'll be out of the league in 3 years ... if he starts here its more a reflection of CK being that bad as opposed to BO being even average ...

Why are your resorting to making crap up. I posted an article on how it went down. He wasn't "benched." Manning got healthy and reclaimed his job. Stop making crap up.

And if I'm not mistaken, there were a lot of eyebrows raised when Manning was put back in, weren't there?

I posted the article. I will find it again if I have to.

The bottom line is this: Manning got hurt. Denver had to play Brock. Brock played way better than Manning. The fans and media were wanting to stick w/Brock because he was playing better than Manning had. In the end, Denver decided to stick w/Manning for the playoffs.

I just don't like when posters post BS to further their agenda. The same dudes saying this stuff don't even take time to break down the videos. They're mind is made up. Total hogwash.

And once again. I am NOT saying Brock should be the starter. I am NOT saying he is good. I simply think that it should be an open competition and let the best man win. I don't have my head 8 inches up Cody's butt like some.

I agree.

QB Brock Osweiler emerges as favorite to start for the Cleveland Browns

http://www.oregonlive.com/nfl/index.ssf/2017/06/qb_brock_osweiler_emerges_as_f.html



By Geoffrey C. Arnold

The Oregonian/OregonLive

Brock Osweiler was an ignored quarterback when he arrived in Cleveland after the Browns acquired him in a trade with the Houston Texans in March.

A $72 million bust in Houston, the Browns immediately attempted to trade Osweiler, but couldn't complete a deal. Osweiler's situation has changed dramatically since those dark days. Osweiler has performed very well in organized team activities (OTAs) and minicamp, and he is expected to enter training camp as the No. 1 quarterback and he'll likely be the starter when the Browns open the regular season.

Osweiler has come a long way since he was virtually run out of Houston after a disastrous season in 2016. He finished the season with 15 touchdown passes and 16 interceptions while posting a 72 passer rating. The on-field performance was bad enough, but the four-year, $72 million contract scared nearly everyone away.

Except the Browns, who were willing to take Osweiler off the Texans hands with the thought of immediately trading him.

"I don't judge people by what everybody else says. But everybody has a reputation before them. His was a little bit different," Browns coach Hue Jackson told reporters in May. "He's not any of that that we've (seen). The guy has been outstanding in our building, and I think that's what's most important."

sweiler doesn't have much competition at the position. Second-year player Cody Kessler and 2017 first-round draft pick DeShone Kizer are battling for the backup spot.

yea I said Brock or Kizer starts week 1.

and if Kizer said he is not ready and Hue said they are in no hurry to start Kizer but develop him.

Then Brock week 1 starter followed by Cody and then Kizer/Hogan.

Well as long as u have an article, i guess that settles it ...





I'm surprised your computer didn't burn up when u typed that .. *LOL*



Ive watched every snap hes taken for the last two years ... i dont need to break down his highlight video ...



Guess i could learn about being open minded from your example with CK ...



U crap on CK every chance u get .. I've said he will improve this year but we have no clue how much ... I've said i think his ceiling is a good back up ... yup ... that sounds like someone with his head up CK's ass ...

I've also said if BO starts its more a reflection on CK and the fact he didn't improve enough ...

Later Vers ... this is not productive ... enjoy yourself ... I'm out ...

It doesn't settle anything, but I could tell that you never even took the time to read it because your mind was made up.



Actually, one of the tapes was for EVERY throw he made in the game. And another was about the entire game and NOT a Brock highlight film. Don't check them out, though. You might learn something. LOL..........I actually remember when you used to like to learn.




I think he will improve, too. Never said he wouldn't. You just keep putting words into my mouth. Here is what I think.............he can improve his game management, his nerves, his reads, him not pissing down his leg and throwing the ball backwards out of the endzone, being quicker w/his decisions, etc. But, until I see it happen.......I have my doubts [just like I did when he was in college] of being able/willing to challenge a defense vertically or horizonatally.



Promise? LOL

Oh, and I think it is productive because I believe in keeping an open mind about the QB competition is productive rather than giving the job to any of these guys or by the same token, eliminating them.

You forgot to mention the name of the bum that replaced Brock.... Peyton "Omaha" Manning.... HOF First ballot for sure.

Sheesh....

I don't rule out Brock. I was sticking up for the guy early on.

I am not saying he will be the guy. In the long run, it will probably be Kiser, but hey, we are due a break.

But, this could also be build-up in a effort to trade the guy after camp opens. Someone is going to need a QB.

I am willing to let this one play out and see how it goes through camp. I don't have any real vested interest in any of our QBs on the roster. I think we are in a position that one of them will emerge to be at least a fairly good trigger man for this season.

I have never been one to think you have to have a best QB on the field. You just need one good enough, because unlike baseball or hockey where a pitcher or goalie really do win games for their team when they are "on", a QB still has to rely on other players to get the job done. I don't think a QB should have a win/loss record.

If I was to bet, Brock will be opening day starter barring a meltdown, I think last year was an issue in playing for O'brien, I think in a system tailored for him he could be a stop gap, He has an NFL arm and size esp for the AFCN. I think he'll either be the starter or moved. I think you have to get Kizer some game reps this year to get an idea of what we have before a QB heavy draft next year.

Brock Osweiler looks like a legit factor in the Browns' QB battle, not a salary dump


CHRIS BURKE
Friday June 16th, 2017

BEREA, Ohio — This is not a sideshow. It’s not doing a favor for a veteran player, nor is it merely trying to make the best of a bad situation.

O.K., maybe it’s a little bit that last one.

No matter how they reached this point, though, this much was clear as the rebuilding Browns wrapped their three-day mini-camp Thursday: Brock Osweiler will enter training camp next month with every opportunity to win the starting quarterback job.

“I’m speaking from my heart: He has been great,” Browns quarterbacks coach David Lee said. “His questions have been great. He has a lot of questions, but he oughta have. He knows how to play, he knows systems and when a read doesn’t make sense to him, there’s a reason it doesn’t because of somewhere he’s been before. I can’t speak of where he’s been before but I’ll tell you right now … he looks like a guy that’s played before. He’s great at the line of scrimmage, he’s great in the huddle, [has a] calming effect.

“Is he the QB yet? We ain’t got one yet, but he’s in the mix, for sure.”

This is a long way removed from March 9, when Houston traded Osweiler to Cleveland and the Browns’ official press release on the matter highlighted the acquisition of a 2018 second-round draft pick. “Cleveland will also acquire Houston’s 2017 sixth-round pick (188th overall) and QB Brock Osweiler for the Browns’ 2017 fourth-round compensatory pick (142nd overall),” the release read.

At the time, it appeared little more than a salary-dump deal—the Texans clearing Osweiler’s $16 million guaranteed salary for ’17 off their books; the Browns obliging with their excess cap space.

The outlook shifted over the ensuing weeks, in large part because Osweiler has impressed the Browns’ coaching staff. Hue Jackson at the end of OTAs called Osweiler a “pleasant surprise”, a phrase Lee repeated Thursday.

“You can say what you want, but [Osweiler] in the last two years has taken two different teams to the playoffs,” Lee said, “and there’s nobody else in that room that can say that, plus this is his sixth year of experience. We’ve got no experience. [DeShone] Kizer’s been here four months, the other two [Cody Kessler and Kevin Hogan] were rookies last year.”

Argue if you want (and you should) the notion that Osweiler “took” either the 2015 Broncos or the ’16 Texans to the playoffs. He was benched in both instances, the latter after securing a high-priced deal as a free agent. But he does have 21 career starts, and 36 total appearances, under his belt.

Considering how NFL coaches treat experience as if it one day may replace paper money as official currency, that playing time matters.

“Pressure is something that we all want to ignore, but at the end of the day it is there,” Osweiler said during a press conference Wednesday. “We have pressure to get our job done, to help our team win football games. That can’t be replicated until you’re a full-time starter in the NFL ... you don’t know how to handle that on a week to week basis.”

Osweiler ran the second-team offense throughout mini-camp, while Kessler and Kizer split time with the 1s—Kessler took the earlier snaps Tuesday and Thursday; Kizer had them Wednesday. Those reps matter, of course, but the order in which they are doled out will carry a lot more weight in July and August.

Reading into them also would be easier on a team with a more settled roster. While Kessler and Kizer had the benefit of working with top WR Kenny Britt during those team drills, receivers like Josh Boyce, Rannell Hall, Ricardo Louis and Rashard Higgins cycled through. In other words, especially with receiver Corey Coleman missing from practice due to injury, the Browns are far from having their depth chart pinned down.

Kessler’s edge comes from the year spent in the system. He started eight games as a rookie in 2016 after being taken in Round 3 out of USC. Cleveland lost all of those Kessler starts en route to 1–15, but again: Experience counts.

Kizer is the shiny new toy, a bit of a gift delivered the Browns by the rest of the league when he slipped to the No. 52 pick in this year’s draft.

“His big-play ability, that’s what that dude’s gonna give this football team if he ever becomes the starter one day,” Lee says. “The way his ball moves and jumps off his hand and gets to the receiver in a hurry … that’s what I see in him, is a big, strong guy, which is defined in this division by Ben [Roethlisberger] and by Joe Flacco, and this kid’s in that mold."

The Browns would love Kizer to be their future at QB, but how soon will that moment arrive? Lee added that his rookie is “a long way from being ready,” with just training camp and the preseason left before Cleveland’s season opener against Pittsburgh.

“How many really great young talents had to start Day One, bad things happened and they’re sitting, looking up at the ceiling in the meeting room, thinking, ‘What’s going on with my life?’” Lee said. “You’d love to not put him in there until he’s ready, but we don’t know when that is.”

With all of Cleveland’s QBs, the goal this spring and summer has been to clean up fundamentals. Lee describes both Osweiler and Kizer as “long striders,” an issue in mechanics that often leads to inaccuracy in the passing game. The goal for Kessler, meanwhile, has been to add velocity to his throws so he could drive the ball deep. “He was always accurate,” said Lee, “but he wasn’t really that deadly accurate past 15 yards, but he’s gotten better and better.”

Anyone who saw Osweiler flail in 14 regular-season starts last season (and again in a playoff loss to New England) knows how dismal his game can be when he’s reeling. For all the stability Cleveland’s staff feels he brings to the QB room, the improvement obviously has to be there on the field, too.

Even Thursday, as the Browns worked on two-minute drills during an abbreviated practice, it was a mixed bag for Osweiler. He did manage to complete his task: Take the offense from its own 37 into field-goal range, starting with 1:04 left on the clock. He also nearly threw an interception to Briean Boddy-Calhoun—the second-year CB was unable to tiptoe the sideline after an errant deep ball; it’s hard to say, without the benefit of a replay, whether Osweiler misread the play, there was a miscommunication with his receiver or the receiver simply slipped for a moment. And a second pass flew dangerously into the secondary for an incompletion, as one of those aforementioned “long strides” led to Osweiler overshooting a target across the middle.

“Brock knows it,” Lee said. “It’s just when we start moving around, the bullets start flying, his legs get long again like daddy long legs and that’s when he gets in trouble and the ball sails. It comes out of his hand too high, because of his long stride, his body doesn’t catch up. Any passer gets long, the ball comes out too early. Their brain says, ‘Let it go,’ but their body hasn’t caught up with their front foot, so the ball sails. It’s a lot of work to get a guy to master the footwork.”

At what point, if any, does it become too late to make those fixes? In hindsight, Osweiler’s fit within Bill O’Brien’s Texans scheme turned out to be a clunky one, but can the now 26-year-old QB eliminate enough bad habits of the past to win another chance as a starter?

“I think the biggest thing, and I think coming off last season, is protecting the football,” Osweiler said, on the main element he needs to work on this summer. “I think I did a pretty good job in 2015 protecting the ball; last year I didn’t do a good job. I had a very large focus on making great decisions with the football, and I feel like I’ve done that this camp.”

All of this figures to weigh on the Browns, and on Jackson specifically, until someone separates himself from the pack. “For me, I have to continue to solve the quarterback issue because that is where it starts,” Jackson said. “Everywhere else, we are really growing. Not that we are not growing at quarterback, but just having a guy and saying, ‘This guy can run our organization, run our team and play at a high level and help us win.’ That is always going to be the question all of you will have until we solve it.”

So, who is the favorite right now? If Jackson and his staff know the answer, it seems nothing shy of a congressional hearing would get the answer out of them. Even then ...

Congressman: “Who is your starting quarterback?”

Hue Jackson: “I don’t know if I can answer that in an open setting.”
https://www.si.com/nfl/2017/06/16/brock-...flow_twitter_si

I am liking everything I hear from Lee. He seems like a good coach.

As long as his teaching method turns on a light in at least 1 of our QB's, he is a great coach.

Many times it's not about them being a good coach. The vast majority are. Many times it boils down to them being the right coach for the right player.

I think you know what I mean.

I would just like to add to your post. It also takes having the talent at the position. You can be the best coach there is but if those supplying the talent don't provide you with a QB that's capable of making the transition from college to the pros, it's not going to help.

If Brock is the guy that gives us the BEST chance to win, then GO BROCK! I have no qualms if that's true, him being the opening day starter. He needs to take all those "fundamentals" teachings as serious as serious can get.

I'll be honest, I didn't think he'd be on the roster at this stage - but now I'll be honest again, I won't be shocked if he is indeed the opening day starter.

That's a pretty darn good summary of the situation.

jc...

Just read that Ryan Tannehill may have been injured in practice today...

If Tannehill is injured, what’s next for the Dolphins?
Posted by Mike Florio on August 3, 2017, 10:19 AM EDT
link


Every time there is a QB injury, Brock O. could be moving on...

Would be nice to trade him off, eat a little of his money and send him away.

With our luck we trade away a young talented(26 year old QB Brock Osweiler) to another team and he goes on to have a Pro Bowl year and puts that team in the playoffs while the Browns QB's stink up the joint and we win two games and right back to the drawing board we go.

this is typical Browns luck.

Back to being Mr. Happy again I see LOL

Trade them Kevin Hogan

Ryan Tannehill - QB - Dolphins

ESPN's Adam Schefter reports the Dolphins are "concerned" about Ryan Tannehill's left knee injury.

The Miami Herald's Armando Salguero adds the team is "fearing the worst." The report is notable both because it suggests the injury is serious and because it confirms the issue is with his left knee, the same knee he suffered a partially torn ACL late last season. Tannehill suffered the setback when he stepped awkwardly while scrambling out of bounds during Thursday's practice.

Source: Adam Schefter on Twitter Aug 3 - 11:05 AM

Osweiler was also in Denver for three years with Adam Gase (the Dolphins head coach and offensive coordinator). I don't know if that is a good thing or a bad thing.

Speculation on NFLN goes immediately to Cutler, Kaep, and Romo ... hopefully Gase DOES think Brock has some chance

He'd know more that most folks.

Osweiler is on his 3rd team for a reason and it's not because he's good
Either
He's a stop gap qb at best

He could be a late bloomer

I believe he is 3rd string simply because Hue doesn't expect him to be here and he is getting Kizer and Cody the first team reps.

Maybe we can do what Houston did ... give him to a team like Miami for a 7th round pick and taking a portion of his salary off our books ... i dunno .. maybe 8 million ....

It would be worth it to let him go just for taking some of the cap hit so we have even more for next year ...

ESPN's Josina Anderson reports free agent Colin Kaepernick's "name was raised" in the Dolphins' front office as a potential Ryan Tannehill (knee) contingency.

Per Anderson, the Dolphins have discussed Kap as "potential insurance" in case Tannehill's knee injury proves to be serious. No matter how serious the talks actually were, it's notable that the Dolphins' front office is already putting out a Kap trial balloon. It could also be Kap's team trying to put pressure on the Ravens to make a decision.

Related: Dolphins

Source: Josina Anderson on Twitter Aug 3 - 2:01 PM

That would be one of the last teams I would expect Kap to go to lol. Miami fans are generally older fans, most from north east and midwest or from the Cuban community that appreciate what America has given them. Very patriotic fan base. Its not 49er country where they salute a rainbow flag.

Ryan Tannehill - QB - Dolphins

NFL Network's Aditi Kinkhabwala reports Ryan Tannehill (knee) has avoided structural damage.

Kinkhabwala reports Tannehill could still miss time, but that the worst-case scenarios have been avoided. Tannehill's troublesome left knee buckled in non-contact fashion on Thursday morning. Tannehill suffered an ACL injury last December, but opted against surgery. Tannehill's knee could turn into a looming specter until he gets a few healthy regular season games under his belt.

Source: Aditi Kinkhabwala on Twitter Aug 3 - 4:04 PM

Wow..

Well, the Browns front office will continue to hope that some team gets hard up enough at QB to take Brock O. off their hands for something..anything!

Ryan Tannehill - QB - Dolphins

ESPN's Jeff Darlington reports the Dolphins haven't ruled out season-ending surgery for Ryan Tannehill (knee).

Tannehill avoided "full tears" on Thursday's practice fall, but team officials haven't ruled out "a procedure that would fully repair" the ACL and MCL Tannehill partially tore last December. The team is still awaiting further test results. It's possible Tannehill and the Dolphins won't fully trust his troublesome left knee until it has been surgically repaired.

Source: ESPN.com Aug 3 - 7:20 PM

wow...

Cutler


Kaepernick





















Osweiler

now they're saying surgery is most likely coming, which would all but end his year. we'll see what happens

I believe that at this point at least, it could be a big mistake to trade or cut Osweiler. Whether you believe him to be good, bad, or indifferent, he represents the only significant degree of experience amongst our 4 contenders (pretenders?). I'm thinking he may end up being our starter based solely on potential. JMHO of course...

Trade him. Its so obvious that Brock is not in our plans.

I wonder if someone in the organization has already made a call to south beach.

Adam Gase is there.

It makes sense.

I bet they have. I mean... right?!?

j/c

If we can't get:

A 3rd AND they take the salary...

I'd just keep the guy.

Pipe? Maybe. But it's my pipe.

Clipboard Jesus and Bruce Gradkowski weren't in our plans at this point of their respective seasons either. We have to pay B O no matter what, might as well keep him.

That's highway robbery.

I'd take a 7th and pay half the salary.

WE eat his salary and they give us a 2 or 3

I'd just keep him for that offer. We have the cap room. Someone is going to overpay for him before we cut him loose.

I guess i could go for something like that.

IMO, Brock might be the starting QB next year. Hue might be running Kizer and Kessler with the ones so that he can evaluate them while Brock picks up the offense.

He would still have four weeks to gain chemistry with the guys.



I just don't want to trade away a huge safety net and be stuck with another 1-15 quality football season.

I get that I can't expect too much, but I'd at least like to be excited to watch my team this year. Last year, it just wasn't as much fun

Yeah I wouldn't be in a rush to trade Brock, I still think he's the best option right now..only qb on our roster that has won a game..

How is Osweiler a safety net? He was terrible last year. If his 2016 season was with us and not the Texans, no one would want him anywhere near the field.

ooops .. what cfr said ....

I'd trade him for a 7th and 1/2 his salary ... another 8 mill in cap space this or next year certainly isn't going to hurt ..

I think we can both enjoy our pipes .. *L* ..

If winning a game in the NFL qualifies a QB to be the best option then there are a ton of QBs that are better options than our guys.

Wins and losses are just about the worst way to evaluate a QB.

Tim Tebow is the perfect example of why you are right. Sometimes a good team can win despite the QB, not because of the QB.

Brock Osweiler is also the perfect example of why I am right. He was the worst QB in the league and went 8-6. I'm sure the best defense in the league didn't have anything to do with that record.

Brock Osweiller on the Texans might have been weak, but the year before on the Broncos, he wasn't that bad. Elway was ready to drop a decent amount of money on him to be their starter.

I just don't think Elway would be that wrong in a decision.



I don't think Brock is the long-term answer. But I don't think he's the worst QB in the NFL or anything.

Like I said, I wouldn't be surprised if he's the best guy on this team right now. I really don't like what I've heard about Kessler, and I saw some stuff last season at Notre Dame that makes me think Kizer might need a bit of time before starting. Kizer was just so inconsistent.



I get that Osweiller looked terrible last year. But he didn't look too bad when I watched him play for the Super Bowl Broncos. Folks point out to his play in Houston, but ignore his play in Denver.

There really isn't anything out there worth a damn so they should be calling. if we can get a day 2 pick for Brock, you go for it. Don't look back. 1 year guy for us at 16 mil as a backup vs getting some salary relief and a pick. Sashi pulls off a 2nd to take him and a 2nd to ship him, he is a freaking genius.

Brock Osweiler was so good in Denver that they benched him in favor of a QB who threw 17 INTs in 10 games. Osweiler was mediocre in a small sample size for Denver, when teams started to figure him out, he was benched. He then played in 15 games for the Texans and was terrible.

John Elway is not infallible. All NFL front offices make mistakes. Elway and the Broncos dodged a bullet when Osweiler didn't take their offer.

Not me Petey .. i watched EVERY SNAP HE TOOK in Denver and Houston ... he had some positives in denver ... but overall he was below average at best ...

The O talent he had in both places FAR EXCEEDS OURS .. we have no one named Hopkins, Thomas, Sanders or Miller on our team ..

in denver he was BENCHED for a QB formerly known as Payton Manning .. he literally couldn't throw the ball 30 yards downfield anymore ... he had a 9:17 TD to INt. Ratio ... ya ... 9 TOUCHDOWNS to 17 PICKS ... even Payton's rookie year wasn't near that bad .. i think his rookie year it was 25:28 ..

This dude may start .. but like I said .. its not cause he's EVEN AVERAGE .. it will be because CK showed zero improvement and Hue decided to do the right thing with Kizer ...

We only have ONE POTENTIAL starting QB on this roster ... and like you, I'd rather see him sit for the year ... but it appears were not going to get our wish ...

Yep.

Look...I don't think he's any good...by any stretch. At the same time, I don't think he's awful.

We've gone through more than 2-3 QBs per year more often than I can remember. I'd keep him as QB 3 and try to get Hogan to the PS. BO - as bad as he is - has value to us and even more value to a team like the Dolphins or Colts. (Insert vomit icon.)

If Hogan was/is a viable #3, then maybe I'd be more-inclined to give BO away for salary relief. But I think someone is going to overpay for him...again.

If you are using two or three QBs, you are probably terrible. You can be terrible no matter who your QB is. Trade the #3 for something and be terrible with more draft picks (hello Andy Lee!).

I think Brock has more value right now than a day two pick for us...now come a few weeks in the season and we get an idea how the line looks and the rest of the QB's , then so be it

We need 2-3 QB's every year because of all the injuries. Heck, last year we needed 6!! I'd keep 3 QB's and put KH on the practice squad.

If we can get a 2018 3rd (or even a 2nd!), I'd work it so that we eat all but $2 or $3 million of his salary.

I mean, seriously.... we would effectively then pay $13-14 million to receive a 2nd and a 2nd/3rd so that we could broker Houston sending Osweiller to Miami. The cash is meaningless to us; this would be akin to robbery on the level only the IRS and banks can pull off.

I'm not sure we could get anything but a conditional 6/7 rounder. But I could be wrong.

He is going to be our QB for the next 5 to 7 years. He not going anywhere lol.

That is enough for me.

He's probably the best we got right now, and that ain't saying much, yet, people want to get rid of him.

just hope Brock played good enough to make Miami go hmm lol

Tony Grossi‏Verified account @TonyGrossi 25m25 minutes ago
More
After viewing practice & listening to Hue Jackson, I expect Brock Osweiler will be Browns starting QB on Thus nite v Saints. We'll see Mon.

Brock did a pretty good job against our 1's with reserves on his side. The others did nothing with our 1's against our reserves, and got extra plays to boot.

BO deserves reps with the 1's.

https://twitter.com/NateUlrichABJ/status/893927215427190784

I trust Nate Ulrich more than I trust Tony Grossi.

An article on the subject:

https://www.ohio.com/akron/sports/browns...t-deshone-kizer

2. Sagging confidence: The biggest tip-off of a switch to Osweiler – and not to rookie DeShone Kizer – was Jackson’s stated desire to win a game on Thursday to set a tone for the preseason. “I want to go through the weekend, go through last night and go through today and really sit down and make what I think is the best decision for our football team for Thursday night,” Jackson said. “That is what is important. I will keep stressing that Thursday night may be different than what the regular season may be. If it is, it is. If it isn’t, then it isn’t, too. My job is to make sure that I put the guy out there who gives us the best chance to score points and help this team win. That is what I’m going to do.” Jackson conceded that he has a different urgency about this preseason than last year, when the Browns went 0-4 in practice games and proceeded to lose 14 in a row in the real season en route to a 1-15 debacle. “I do not want to go 0-4 again,” Jackson said. “I don’t want to feel like that. I don’t think this team deserves that. We need to go out and play good in front of our fans and go win. I don’t care what we are playing. I just think that has got to be our mindset. I think the mindset is different than what it is. If we are going to play, we need to go win. Everybody … says that, but I mean it. We need to go win.”

http://www.espn.com/blog/cleveland/post/...-preseason-game

why he has to ask the fo i would think...

We are so screwed.

Wow ... Hue sounds like hes under pressure allready ... pre season isn't about winning and losing ... its about evaluating ...

With that said .. I'd expect to see our starters out there longer than most teams to build some continuity and cohesion ... i get that ...

This however sounds like hes putting undue pressure on himself and for some reason he thinks a pre season win will somehow carry over into the regular season ... not sure of his reasoning here ... this ain't his first rodeo ...

For his sake i hope we go 4 - 0 or at least win 1 game ... if we go 0 - 4 it sounds like hes going to meltdown before the games actually matter ... ...

*LOL* .. theres that over reacting thing ...

I am only reacting to Hue Jackson's words. We are going to be bad this year and Jackson is worried about a preseason game. That is not a good sign.

I agree with that ... about him worrying about a pre-season game ...

I'm also wondering why he has diarrhea of the mouth when it comes to the QB situation ... he's talking in circles almost .... make a statement and move on .... if i was him ...

" our qb situation is fluid right now, the sooner we have a clear cut starter the better but as of now we need more info" ...

Not much more to say than that ...

It also worries me that he wants Sashi's and Podesta's input on this decision ... isn't he the FOOTBALL COACH ... I'm not a fan at all of FO folks having input on who the starters are ... but thats just me ..

this. I know it's about collaboration, but if I'm Sashi or Depdesta ... I'd say, YOU'RE the coach. Pick who you need. Do what you want with reps, etc.

Well that actually would have Brock with the 2's as they get the most reps in the first game not the starter...one or two series only.

Brock did very good but too bad he couldn't finish. FG's are for losers....

We got two preseason games and practices for QB to be settled and decided on...I think we are over reacting on a scrimmage with our own team where we cannot hit the QB. Knocking the QB down has a lot of effect.

jmho...if anyone offers us a 3rd rounder or better its a no brainer.

While "worrying" about winning a preseason game isn't the way to go about it.

I understand the idea of wanting to win. Regardless of what kind of game it is.

There's a lot of young guys here. Whom a lot of probably won a lot in college. Then they come into the NFL and lose 14 (18) straight games..

That bleeds into a season where you're 0-4 and "Welp, here we go again"

You can't turn a losing culture, into a winning one, without winning.

Even if it has to start in the preseason.

Very good point...

He sounds worried about winning and stressed about his QB options.

If Brock starts, and I was on record saying I wouldn't be surprised if so, then this means two obvious things:

1. Cody will not ever posses the physical traits to operate Hue's offense.

2. Kizer is not close to being ready, despite all the "reports" saying as such.

Agreed. Young players many of which just went thru a 1 and 15 season. Needs wins whenever they can get them. If for no other reason besides confidence building.

If Kessler doesn't have the physical tools to run Jackson's offense then why did he even draft him last year ?
Drafting Kessler is and was a huge blunder by this organization and compounded by the fact Presscot was still on the board
Giving reps to Kessler now is a waste of time cause we all know what he is as a qb.
Let Kizer be the starter. It was make him that much more ready for 2018.
Osweiler isn't any better than the last 14 starting qbs for the Browns. He has no upside at all.